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TSA Plans to Use Face Recognition to Track Americans Through Airports

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Re: TSA Plans to Use Face Recognition to Track Americans Through Airports

#41

Post by staticelf »

0x62 wrote: post #39
zkms wrote: post #3

They already have this at Gatwick, there's security gates/turnstiles where the system doesn't let you pass until it's scanned your face and associated it with your boarding pass, and IIRC they scanned faces again right before boarding. There's also cameras scattered throughout the airport which have spinning/swirly LED rings around the lens (which look like this: https://www.hrsid.com/assets/images/art/proven-passeng…

When arriving, if you have an EU passport you don't even need to go through human immigration/customs. They have a turnstile which scans your passport, then a camera which compares it to your face before letting you through.

Which is absolutely awesome since it goes very fast to go through the checks.

Re: TSA Plans to Use Face Recognition to Track Americans Through Airports

#42

Post by mseebach »

zkms wrote: post #3

They already have this at Gatwick, there's security gates/turnstiles where the system doesn't let you pass until it's scanned your face and associated it with your boarding pass, and IIRC they scanned faces again right before boarding. There's also cameras scattered throughout the airport which have spinning/swirly LED rings around the lens (which look like this: https://www.hrsid.com/assets/images/art/proven-passeng…

I get the dystopian flavour of surveillance in general society -- but I don't really get why it's specifically dystopian that you are recorded by a camera while you stand in line to hand over your government issued photo ID to a government agent with pretty broad discretion to make your day pretty awful.

I'm pretty sure those cameras at Gatwick are supposed to track how long the waiting time is, not to "surveil" you in any meaningful sense.

Re: TSA Plans to Use Face Recognition to Track Americans Through Airports

#43

Post by ajdlinux »

robryk wrote: post #28
joelrunyon wrote: post #13

When you fly into HKG - they pretty forcefully make you take off any confusing items that obscure your face (specifically hats) when walking away from your gate. Pretty obvious what they're doing.

I remember something similar in Taiwan in 2008. The ostensible reason was that they want to have a thermal camera pointed at people's faces so that they can see if someone has a fever. I don't expect that face recognition was the real reason at that time. Also, what do they do with people wearing lots of makeup?

I remember seeing thermal cameras in HKG when I went there in 2005, in the aftermath of SARS.

Re: TSA Plans to Use Face Recognition to Track Americans Through Airports

#44

Post by ajdlinux »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #17
ekianjo wrote: post #6

I think Australia plans to switch to full face recognition based immigration check in the very near future (next year) for its airports, as long as you have a biometric passport. So the whole process would be automated.

It already is, isn't it? I didn't have to talk to anybody as I went through immigration a couple of months ago, I just scanned my passport, and looked at the camera, and they let me in. Same story for New Zealand. Or do you mean you wouldn't even have to scan your passport?

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/national/public-service/faci...

Re: TSA Plans to Use Face Recognition to Track Americans Through Airports

#45

Post by skate22 »

mtgx wrote: post #40
sho wrote: post #4

> (Every government on earth) plans to use face recognition to track (everyone) through airports Fixed it for you. I know for a fact at least 2 asian countries which are either actively using or trialling this, and not just at airports. Both already have fairly comprehensive facial recognition DBs of their citizens (smile for your driver's license picture!) I've also heard anecdotal accounts of people who stay too lo…

> The tech is there. This is why comments such "but spy agencies have always been spying, it's their job" have always pissed me off. The spy agencies will continue to encroach on our rights the more "tech is here". We now have "smart" devices with mics and cameras in every room, so they're going to use that. If 30 years from now we'll use some kind of "bluetooth headset" that actually interacts directly with our thou…

When your "right" to privacy starts conflicting with your "right" to safety, something has to give.

Re: TSA Plans to Use Face Recognition to Track Americans Through Airports

#46

Post by FRex »

sho wrote: post #25
FRex wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There might be problems with the laws still. I.e. Polish constitution has 'Public authorities shall not acquire, collect nor make accessible information on citizens other than that which is necessary in a democratic state ruled by law.'. There are many techs out there that are quite dystopian (face scans, mass surveillance, etc.) or outright evil (alleged organ harvesting of death row inmates in China) but yet the go…

> other than that which is necessary in a democratic state ruled by law Well the thing is that is open to interpretation. You can define anything as "necessary". From what I have heard the typical "foot in the door", if you will, is AML/KYC. There's a convenient intersection there between anti-terrorism (national security) and the everyday (banking). Bring those together and now you have a perfectly plausible excuse…

That was just an example of such a line since I know only Polish constitution.

I know that everything legal is open to really wide and crazy interpretations already but if there weren't such a line to interpret there would be no chance for an anti-scanning interpretation. It could also end up being limited to foreigners since the line protects citizens specifically.

It depends what do you mean by biometrics database, i.e.: Polish passports are 'biometric' and have two index fingerprints stored in them for a few years now. I have no idea if the passport database is accessible to police or if there is any face scanning going on.

I'd say the foot in the door is airports themselves. You already need a passport or ID there so the face scan is literally no new information and only confirming what the papers say. The real creepy tech to me is mass country wide face scanning to track everyone everywhere 24/7 and see what they do, who they associate with, etc. and possible future airport brain scans (like MRI to detect positive or negative emotions in response to a country flag or a picture of state head for example).

Re: TSA Plans to Use Face Recognition to Track Americans Through Airports

#47

Post by lucaspiller »

zkms wrote: post #3

They already have this at Gatwick, there's security gates/turnstiles where the system doesn't let you pass until it's scanned your face and associated it with your boarding pass, and IIRC they scanned faces again right before boarding. There's also cameras scattered throughout the airport which have spinning/swirly LED rings around the lens (which look like this: https://www.hrsid.com/assets/images/art/proven-passeng…

Might as well just link directly to the manufacturer as these ‘features’ are the selling point of this hardware:

http://www.hrsid.com/product-mflow

Re: TSA Plans to Use Face Recognition to Track Americans Through Airports

#48

Post by triplesec »

skate22 wrote: post #45
mtgx wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The tech is there. This is why comments such "but spy agencies have always been spying, it's their job" have always pissed me off. The spy agencies will continue to encroach on our rights the more "tech is here". We now have "smart" devices with mics and cameras in every room, so they're going to use that. If 30 years from now we'll use some kind of "bluetooth headset" that actually interacts directly with our thou…

When your "right" to privacy starts conflicting with your "right" to safety, something has to give.

A false dichotomy should always give first. You can both be safe and have privacy

Re: TSA Plans to Use Face Recognition to Track Americans Through Airports

#49

Post by [deleted] »

skate22 wrote: post #45
mtgx wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The tech is there. This is why comments such "but spy agencies have always been spying, it's their job" have always pissed me off. The spy agencies will continue to encroach on our rights the more "tech is here". We now have "smart" devices with mics and cameras in every room, so they're going to use that. If 30 years from now we'll use some kind of "bluetooth headset" that actually interacts directly with our thou…

When your "right" to privacy starts conflicting with your "right" to safety, something has to give.

[deleted]

Re: TSA Plans to Use Face Recognition to Track Americans Through Airports

#50

Post by cmiles74 »

skate22 wrote: post #45
mtgx wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The tech is there. This is why comments such "but spy agencies have always been spying, it's their job" have always pissed me off. The spy agencies will continue to encroach on our rights the more "tech is here". We now have "smart" devices with mics and cameras in every room, so they're going to use that. If 30 years from now we'll use some kind of "bluetooth headset" that actually interacts directly with our thou…

When your "right" to privacy starts conflicting with your "right" to safety, something has to give.

In my opinion, that's just propaganda. It's not at all clear that all the surveillance is making anyone safer.
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