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Face ID beaten by mask

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61–70 of 244 posts

Re: Face ID beaten by mask

#61

Post by mtgx »

KeitIG wrote: post #13

So, fingerprints are not "secure", face recognition is not "secure"... Are passwords/double authentication the only way to keep things private and secure these days? Are there any serious alternative?

> Are passwords/double authentication the only way to keep things private and secure these days

That's always been the case. The main promise of biometric security was not "better security", but better convenience. The best argument for it would be that it makes average security better, in the sense that more people use it than not use anything at all or re-using passwords, but it's not the best way to secure your devices.

Password manager + U2F token is the most secure way to lock your accounts.

Re: Face ID beaten by mask

#62

Post by amelius »

sambeau wrote: post #9

As a consumer this doesn't worry me as to be able to crack my phone it looks like they would already have to have access to my face to make the mask (and an expert sculpture to make a nose). If they could demonstrate it working from a 3D printed mask taken from a surreptitious scan at distance in the outdoors then I think we'd have reason to be worried. For spies, spooks, government agents etc. I suspect that Face ID…

> If they could demonstrate it working from a 3D printed mask taken from a surreptitious scan at distance

A scanner could be placed e.g. behind or on top of a mirror in a restroom.

Re: Face ID beaten by mask

#65

Post by ploggingdev »

I was hoping they released more details about the process. One possible method is that they trained the iphone's Face ID on the mask by repeatedly failing to unlock it with the mask and then entering the passcode which trains the iphone's neural net on the new face (mask in this case). There was a video a few days ago where the iphone X was unlocked by a man's brother by doing this : https://9to5mac.com/2017/11/04/face-id-siblings-fail/ .

This was posted 2 days ago, any statement from apple on this story?

Re: Face ID beaten by mask

#66

Post by Yizahi »

KeitIG wrote: post #13

So, fingerprints are not "secure", face recognition is not "secure"... Are passwords/double authentication the only way to keep things private and secure these days? Are there any serious alternative?

Fingerprint or face or retina is not a "password", it is a "login". And we should have a proper password in addition to the login, not as a substitute.

Re: Face ID beaten by mask

#67

Post by Cthulhu_ »

Yizahi wrote: post #64

I wish both companies would allow us to have both PIN/PASS + biometric together and not strictly separately as it is now. At least as an option.

It would make a lot of sense for the new iphone actually, since with the PIN you're usually already looking at the screen.

Re: Face ID beaten by mask

#68

Post by IgorPartola »

matwood wrote: post #59
sambeau wrote: post #9

As a consumer this doesn't worry me as to be able to crack my phone it looks like they would already have to have access to my face to make the mask (and an expert sculpture to make a nose). If they could demonstrate it working from a 3D printed mask taken from a surreptitious scan at distance in the outdoors then I think we'd have reason to be worried. For spies, spooks, government agents etc. I suspect that Face ID…

Another thing is that an attacker only gets a few chances to use the face unlock before the phone requires a pin. How many tries did it take them while having to re-enable FaceId after locking the phone? IMO, it's only 'broken' if they can get the face right the first time without causing the phone to lock itself.

Hmm. I read somewhere that if FaceID doesn’t work and you use the PIN, it adds the face to the dataset. Is it possible they just slowly worked the mask into the dataset?

Re: Face ID beaten by mask

#69

Post by staz »

geoah wrote: post #14
baxtr wrote: post #5

> A: We used a popular 3D printer. Nose was made by a handmade artist. We use 2D printing for other parts (similar to how we tricked Face Recognition 9 years ago). The skin was also hand-made to trick Apple's AI. > Q: What's the approximate cost of the mask? > A: ~ 150 USD Taken together, the second answer cannot be true. Only if the cost stated is related to material cost only, which is is only one input factor to a…

I assume this was done in Singapore where prices should be a bit cheaper, if you don't have a 3D printer you can always get a service for the 50 USD, and probably give the rest to an art student to make you the nose? :D Not sure about the "hand-made" skin, but it might just be some white and glossy paint?

This seems to be a Vietnamese firm actually

Re: Face ID beaten by mask

#70

Post by Cthulhu_ »

discordance wrote: post #37

I hope this does not result in me getting 3D face scanned as I pass through border control

Well that was already the case for fingerprints, so, nothing new there. Matter of time before a 3D representation of your face becomes mandatory in biometric IDs / passports too.
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