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How we do Vue at GitLab: one year later

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Re: How we do Vue at GitLab: one year later

#31

Post by sillysaurus3 »

dlwdlw wrote: post #20
ng12 wrote: post #3

> We discovered that VueX makes our lives easier. If you are writing a medium to large feature, use VueX. If it's a tiny feature, you might get away without it. I feel like this is Vue starting to get the React treatment. React was (and still is!) a very simple library until people realized they needed to do fancy things to make complex applications manageable. Redux came out, everyone fell in love with it, and React…

From my experience telling people this doesn't work as everyone thinks they are smart enough to avoid the trap. Like many companies going into China assuming things will be easy. Code ends up complex yet works because the complexity was successfully wrangled, missing the point of complexity reduction rather than wrangling. Thematically, it may be a result of obsession over tools instead of product which occurs in oth…

One cure for this is to have someone who cares solely about simplicity, as an ideal above all else, in charge of technical decisions.

When you're hyper-vigilant about simplicity, you end up creating the simplest design that meets the goals. It takes a little extra time, but it's so worth it.

Re: How we do Vue at GitLab: one year later

#32

Post by acemarke »

a13n wrote: post #5
ng12 wrote: post #3

> We discovered that VueX makes our lives easier. If you are writing a medium to large feature, use VueX. If it's a tiny feature, you might get away without it. I feel like this is Vue starting to get the React treatment. React was (and still is!) a very simple library until people realized they needed to do fancy things to make complex applications manageable. Redux came out, everyone fell in love with it, and React…

When did new react developers start learning redux? From my experience that just isn't true.

I'm a Redux maintainer, and I spend most of my free time answering questions about React and Redux.

Yes, since probably early 2016, many tutorials have basically said "you need to learn React and Redux together", and that's the message that a lot of junior devs have been taught.

However, my own advice is the same as Dan Abramov's: you should focus on learning React first. Once you understand React thoroughly, then you'll better understand why a state management lib like Redux _may_ be helpful for your situation.

Re: How we do Vue at GitLab: one year later

#33

Post by sillysaurus3 »

k__ wrote: post #28
jaequery wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

no, it's actually quite the opposite. vue took all the complexities out of react/redux it's not even funny.

I'm not talking about Redux.

Then it's an unfair comparison. Vue does state management out of the box. React really doesn't. Yeah, it has setState, but that's nothing compared to Vue.

Re: How we do Vue at GitLab: one year later

#34

Post by ng12 »

sillysaurus3 wrote: post #33
k__ wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not talking about Redux.

Then it's an unfair comparison. Vue does state management out of the box. React really doesn't. Yeah, it has setState, but that's nothing compared to Vue.

I'm very skeptical of that assertion. Can you provide an example of something Vue provides that React does not?

Re: How we do Vue at GitLab: one year later

#37

Post by sillysaurus3 »

acemarke wrote: post #32
a13n wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When did new react developers start learning redux? From my experience that just isn't true.

I'm a Redux maintainer, and I spend most of my free time answering questions about React and Redux. Yes, since probably early 2016, many tutorials have basically said "you need to learn React and Redux together", and that's the message that a lot of junior devs have been taught. However, my own advice is the same as Dan Abramov's: you should focus on learning React first. Once you understand React thoroughly, then yo…

However, my own advice is the same as Dan Abramov's: you should focus on learning React first. Once you understand React thoroughly, then you'll better understand why a state management lib like Redux _may_ be helpful for your situation.

That's not really a fair position to take. It basically allows you to believe that React and Redux don't need to be learned together.

Put yourself in the shoes of a CTO at a new startup. They need to decide whether to build their company on top of React or Vue. They need to make this decision quickly.

Is it really fair to say they don't need to learn Redux? And that maybe Redux won't apply to their situation?

Of course Redux will apply, because Redux is for all intents and purposes how you manage state at scale. And everyone who's entering the field who isn't a junior dev is thinking "We need to come up with a way to manage state at scale. Does Vue help us do that, or are we stuck with React+Redux?"

It really doesn't help matters when you look into big players like airbnb and discover that they wrote their own state management framework rather than use Redux. They even have a two week onboarding process for new devs that teach them how to write features using their blend of tech. It's a bit... Eh... The whole thing just feels like WPF, a dead technology that few people here have probably heard of. There must be a simpler way.

Re: How we do Vue at GitLab: one year later

#38

Post by [deleted] »

zackify wrote: post #25
pythonaut_16 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know GitLab's exact motivations although I noticed the same thing. I suspect it might be because they're using Vue components on already existing Server Rendered pages as opposed to a full SPA, so by passing the endpoint in the template they can allow the actual URL for that page to be set in the controller, maintaining cohesiveness. E.g. on the server-side .html.erb they'd have something like ` ... `

Just feels like you're halfway following good JS practices. Ex: using Vue is great, but still rendering templates the "old way" instead of server rendering correctly for the whole app and having components remount. Totally get your point :)

[deleted]

Re: How we do Vue at GitLab: one year later

#40

Post by nightski »

juddlyon wrote: post #35

React made me feel stupid, Vue made me feel smart. So I use Vue. I came at it as a long-time jQuery dev with Angular 1 experience.

In general it's best to push your comfort boundaries. It's called learning. I'm not saying React is better than Vue (I honestly think they are very similar). Just that picking a technology based on whether it challenges you or not is probably not the best strategy.
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