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Cancer Doctors Cite Risks of Drinking Alcohol

nytimes.com

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Re: Cancer Doctors Cite Risks of Drinking Alcohol

#41

Post by cwkoss »

aidos wrote: post #17
maxxxxx wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a thing on BBC where they rated drugs by their danger. If I remember correctly, nicotine and alcohol were way up the list, much higher than most illegal drugs.

My favourite is always Professor David Nutt, fired from his position advising the Home Office for saying ecstasy and LSD were less dangerous than alcohol. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2009/oct/30/drugs-advis... EDIT: David Nutt on how ecstasy isn't as dangerous as "Equasy" http://www.encod.org/info/EQUASY-A-HARMFUL-ADDICTION.html

I think his idea for 'hangover free alcohol' is pretty interesting as well.

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/...

Re: Cancer Doctors Cite Risks of Drinking Alcohol

#43

Post by taneq »

maxxxxx wrote: post #31
gozur88 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh? What should we do?

Stop subsidizing junk food. Stop advertising junk food to children (if it's not ok for children to hear he f word it's also not ok to for them to hear about junk food). Subsidize healthy foods. Tax sugary drinks. Do you want more?

Also stop normalising excessive portion sizes.

Re: Cancer Doctors Cite Risks of Drinking Alcohol

#44

Post by craftyguy »

karmapolic wrote: post #34
chiefalchemist wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IDK but more than one addict has told me their habit was a symptom of a deeper (emotional?) ill. So we could ban alcohol but then what? Would that solve a problem or will something else just take its place?

does not really add to the discussion. even with emotional stress, i personally prefer smoking weed vs alcohol any day and so do a lot of friends of mine.

One anecdotal point does not a successful rebutal make.

Re: Cancer Doctors Cite Risks of Drinking Alcohol

#45

Post by craftyguy »

opportune wrote: post #14
chiefalchemist wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, the impact is greater because the availability is much wider. Social acceptance can make most any evil the norn. Just look at obesity/diabetes. Now there's a killer no one REALLY wants to talk about.

This is talking about the personal danger, not the total societal impact.

Dramatically increasing your risk for heart disease and other health complications is certainly a 'personal danger', but it's too taboo because no one wants to be labeled as someone who "makes fun of obese people".

Re: Cancer Doctors Cite Risks of Drinking Alcohol

#46

Post by aidos »

chiefalchemist wrote: post #35
aidos wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And while most of that research is now banned, Dr Robin Carhart-Harris (who studied under David Nutt) is one of the few researchers still allowed to experiment with psychedelics. I'd highly recommend reading / watching some of his work.

I guess so. But it does seem that once or twice a year I see something about bringing MDMA back as a psycho therapy. I've certainly met plenty of people who could benefit ;)

It definitely seems to be an uphill battle for those working on it. I guess as more research is conducted and evidence gathered, that leads to more acceptance and slowly the tide turns.

Here's a couple of Dr Carhart-Harris clips. The first is at the Secret Garden Party (UK festival) and the second is a debate with a psychology lecturer (which is much more philosophical).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5ifWcdEpCA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F0XYmcpQFjY

Re: Cancer Doctors Cite Risks of Drinking Alcohol

#47

Post by scythe »

munificent wrote: post #38
opportune wrote: post #2

Alcohol is definitely one of the most harmful drugs out there. In terms of addictiveness, physical side effects (short and long term), and the kind of behavior that people are likely to engage in while under the influence, the only things worse are probably IV painkillers and smoked meth/crack. As a society we need to get our heads out of our asses and challenge our notions of what kind of drug use is and isn't accep…

> Alcohol is definitely one of the most harmful drugs out there. What is your definition of "harmful" here? Is it just total amount of harm caused, or total harm divided by number of users? If the former, sure, but I think that just reflects how hugely popular it is. If the latter, I'd like to see your data. Some large fraction of the adult population consumes alcohol on a fairly regular basis so I imagine society wo…

I think mostly when people cite this they are referring to this study:

https://www.webmd.com/mental-health/addiction/news/20101101/...

Alcohol ranks very highly because of it's severe harmful effects on the body. However, behavioral effects tend to be those which make drug users a threat to society.

But cocaine's harm is highly dependent on its form. In some pre-Colombian civilizations, as well as in some parts of modern Colombia and Peru, drinking coca tea is/was quite common, and yet life carries on without serious problems. However, smoked and snorted cocaine tend to cause severe behavioral problems in a subset of users, and high doses of cocaine can cause heart attacks. Legalizing coca leaf/tea is an approach I've toyed with to significantly reduce the profit margin of drug trafficking (hopefully) without increasing the use parenteral cocaine too much.

Re: Cancer Doctors Cite Risks of Drinking Alcohol

#48

Post by dragonwriter »

maxxxxx wrote: post #31
gozur88 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh? What should we do?

Stop subsidizing junk food. Stop advertising junk food to children (if it's not ok for children to hear he f word it's also not ok to for them to hear about junk food). Subsidize healthy foods. Tax sugary drinks. Do you want more?

> (if it's not ok for children to hear he f word it's also not ok to for them to hear about junk food).

Those two things are pretty much completely unrelated. It is certainly bad for children to be exposed to deliberate behavior-mabipulation efforts pushing unhealthy food choices, but that's not in any way related to whether or not it's bad for them to hear words currently viewed as naughty.

Re: Cancer Doctors Cite Risks of Drinking Alcohol

#49

Post by microcolonel »

brightsize wrote: post #36
opportune wrote: post #2

Alcohol is definitely one of the most harmful drugs out there. In terms of addictiveness, physical side effects (short and long term), and the kind of behavior that people are likely to engage in while under the influence, the only things worse are probably IV painkillers and smoked meth/crack. As a society we need to get our heads out of our asses and challenge our notions of what kind of drug use is and isn't accep…

>It's perfectly fine to tell my boss that I got too drunk on Friday Hell if you worked at a startup, you and your boss might have both gotten drunk at the office together after raiding the "fully-stocked beer cooler". The in-office beer was part of the recruitment strategy of the company after all. Bottoms-up! I'm a beer-drinker but I still find it astonishing that some startups are providing an addictive and risky d…

Beer is wonderful after a day of hard work, it is addictive to alcoholics, and risky in large doses. I prefer to buy it myself though, I don't really approve of these things as company perks, since you know it is really meant to bargain down salaries.

Re: Cancer Doctors Cite Risks of Drinking Alcohol

#50

Post by zenlikethat »

microcolonel wrote: post #49
brightsize wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's perfectly fine to tell my boss that I got too drunk on Friday Hell if you worked at a startup, you and your boss might have both gotten drunk at the office together after raiding the "fully-stocked beer cooler". The in-office beer was part of the recruitment strategy of the company after all. Bottoms-up! I'm a beer-drinker but I still find it astonishing that some startups are providing an addictive and risky d…

Beer is wonderful after a day of hard work, it is addictive to alcoholics , and risky in large doses . I prefer to buy it myself though, I don't really approve of these things as company perks, since you know it is really meant to bargain down salaries.

That certainly does happen a lot but in cases where people are paid fairly having free (good) booze available for responsible drinking is also pretty great.
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