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Waymo now testing its self-driving cars on public roads with no one at the wheel

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Re: Waymo now testing its self-driving cars on public roads with no one at the wheel

#621

Post by greedo »

cardiffspaceman wrote: post #596
chiefofgxbxl wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To detail one particular addition of traffic to the roads: students - with self-driving cars, students from K-12 may much rather want to have the independence to hop in a car rather than ride a "stinky school bus". Parents may end up loving it, especially those who already drive their kids to school. And I'm sure the school districts would love self-driving cars, because it means they can pass the travel expenses ont…

I live near an elementary school and I seldom see school buses on the road in the morning, even if I drive in front of the school. I do see fleets of SUVs. The question is, are these cars dropping off kids because the kids like it or because the parents like it? Is it because of class/status or stranger danger? If it is stranger danger, is the parent going to entrust their kids to multi-passenger Lyfts? Or even to si…

Our city in it's infinite wisdom doesn't have public school buses except for special needs kids. So everyone drives their kids to school unless they are close enough to walk (most aren't). The school district uses full size buses for the special needs kids. It's insane. I'd gladly pay higher property taxes, or even a flat fee to have school buses.

Re: Waymo now testing its self-driving cars on public roads with no one at the wheel

#622

Post by greedo »

fps wrote: post #620
sandworm101 wrote: post #578

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if the cars are self-driving, the school doesn't need parking. The kids can be dropped off and the car will drive itself home. Of course that means a doubling the total number of physical trips, but that isn't the school's problem. I'm waiting for the ability to, rather than pay for parking, have my car circle the block while I eat lunch. The cost of running an electric vehicle for a few hours is far less than pa…

The "drop off lane" at my local elementary school is already a 30 minute traffic jam, and that's with parents in the cars hurrying the kids along and school staff directing traffic. You think a robot car is going to get a kid out of a seat with their backpack and lunch faster than a parent? The pick-up line is even worse, as the kids are individually dismissed after the driver has been authorized by the school staff.…

Yeah, forget autonomous vehicles having to cope with snow/ice etc, if they can deal with my schools parking lot at the start and end of the day, they'll be able to handle anything.

Re: Waymo now testing its self-driving cars on public roads with no one at the wheel

#623

Post by greedo »

Johnny555 wrote: post #466
aidenn0 wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still think that proper self-driving cars are such a paradigm shift that predictions of how it will work are still up in the air. For example, right now I live on the west coast and my parents live on the east coast. 4 kids, Minimum of 40 hour drive or $3500 flight. Here's one tiny example: I can work remotely for a few weeks and my boss doesn't mind. The kids sleep for 8+ hours at night. Friday, Saturday, Sunday,…

A $30,000 car that lasts for 200,000 miles costs you $0.15/mile or $450 one way for 3000 miles (I ignored age-based depreciation, but also didn't account for other costs like maintenance and insurance). At 30 mpg (because a car that a family of 6 can feel comfortable riding/sleeping in for 40 hours is not going to be a compact car), that's around $250 for gas. So you're at $700, or $1400 both ways. With advanced purc…

You also need to calculate the cost for a rental car at your destination when flying. So add roughly $100/day to your total stay. When driving, you save that right away.

Re: Waymo now testing its self-driving cars on public roads with no one at the wheel

#624

Post by greedo »

marssaxman wrote: post #597
criddell wrote: post #543

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All you need next is to build A near B That will never happen. When my car can drive itself, I'm moving further out of the city.

Maybe you'll do that, but the net effect would still be a greater migration into the city, because people would be able to have all the benefits of urban living and all the benefits of car mobility, without having to cover the high monthly cost of a downtown parking space. Just leave your car parked out in the suburbs somewhere, program it to move to another parking space at least once every 72 hours so it doesn't ge…

"Difficult to see. Always in motion is the future."

Re: Waymo now testing its self-driving cars on public roads with no one at the wheel

#625

Post by greedo »

Ajedi32 wrote: post #426
greedo wrote: post #341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And towing boats, or ATVs, or anything that won't fit in a small vehicle. Or going to Costco/Sam's Club and loading up on groceries. Sometimes I think many on HN live in an urban bubble without children, where everything is either ordered online or picked up at a bodega on the corner. For much of the US, life is nothing like that. There's a reason the Ford F-150 has been the most popular selling vehicle in the US for…

What makes you think you wouldn't be able to summon a self-driving Ford F-150 via the Waymo app? It's not like minivans are the only cars capable of being self-driving.

You'll end up a) waiting longer for "uncommon" vehicles, b) paying more than for an L5 econobox stuffed with three other commuter.

Minivans are being used in these trials because they can carry multiple people to different destinations. That's the only reason. Minivans suck.

Imagine a boat owner. They need an F-150 with a trailer hitch, plus the wiring for the boat trailer's lights. So if they want to move their boat around, they need to wait 20 mins for something they can currently do right now without waiting, without dealing with network outages, with the ability to tow something heavy.

Look at the sustained performance of a Tesla S at Nurbergring. Towing takes a lot of torque, and will kill a battery like a Tesla. Plus the car needs to be able to get a bit wet/muddy sometimes.

Re: Waymo now testing its self-driving cars on public roads with no one at the wheel

#626

Post by greedo »

jacksmith21006 wrote: post #364
ghaff wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you can't own (or lease, but that's just a financing variant) a self-driving car, the concept is going to be basically a non-starter. People who already take taxis/Uber/Lyft/etc. will appreciate a 50% cut or so in rates but anyone else who already drives a car daily will just pass for most of the same reasons they own a car today.

Do not agree. Habits will change as it will be cheap. My kids already are very, very comfortable using Uber where me and my wife are like let's take our car.

Are your kids paying for Uber out of their own pocket? If not, then their opinion about the financial side is moot. My kids love to be chaeuffered about by me.

Re: Waymo now testing its self-driving cars on public roads with no one at the wheel

#627

Post by Johnny555 »

greedo wrote: post #623
Johnny555 wrote: post #466

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A $30,000 car that lasts for 200,000 miles costs you $0.15/mile or $450 one way for 3000 miles (I ignored age-based depreciation, but also didn't account for other costs like maintenance and insurance). At 30 mpg (because a car that a family of 6 can feel comfortable riding/sleeping in for 40 hours is not going to be a compact car), that's around $250 for gas. So you're at $700, or $1400 both ways. With advanced purc…

You also need to calculate the cost for a rental car at your destination when flying. So add roughly $100/day to your total stay. When driving, you save that right away.

This whole discussion is about how self-driving cars will make car ownership unnecessary -- you don't need a rental car at your destination, you just call a cheap self-driving car to drive you around just like you do at home.

Re: Waymo now testing its self-driving cars on public roads with no one at the wheel

#628

Post by greedo »

Johnny555 wrote: post #627
greedo wrote: post #623

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You also need to calculate the cost for a rental car at your destination when flying. So add roughly $100/day to your total stay. When driving, you save that right away.

This whole discussion is about how self-driving cars will make car ownership unnecessary -- you don't need a rental car at your destination, you just call a cheap self-driving car to drive you around just like you do at home.

The parent was comparing flying to driving cross country.

Re: Waymo now testing its self-driving cars on public roads with no one at the wheel

#629

Post by Johnny555 »

greedo wrote: post #628
Johnny555 wrote: post #627

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This whole discussion is about how self-driving cars will make car ownership unnecessary -- you don't need a rental car at your destination, you just call a cheap self-driving car to drive you around just like you do at home.

The parent was comparing flying to driving cross country.

He's comparing riding in a fully autonomous self-driving car that will let him and his family sleep at night when he's driving to flying. He's not planning on driving his car 40 hours over 4 days himself, I think the number of people that consider that to be a viable option over flying are very low indeed. I can almost agree with him that a self-driving car would make this viable, but I think he's overestimating how comfortable 4 nights of sleeping in the car on the road will be for him and his children.

When that fully autonomous self-driving car exists, then cheap self-driving cars for car-share will exist.

Re: Waymo now testing its self-driving cars on public roads with no one at the wheel

#630

Post by njarboe »

fps wrote: post #620
sandworm101 wrote: post #578

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if the cars are self-driving, the school doesn't need parking. The kids can be dropped off and the car will drive itself home. Of course that means a doubling the total number of physical trips, but that isn't the school's problem. I'm waiting for the ability to, rather than pay for parking, have my car circle the block while I eat lunch. The cost of running an electric vehicle for a few hours is far less than pa…

The "drop off lane" at my local elementary school is already a 30 minute traffic jam, and that's with parents in the cars hurrying the kids along and school staff directing traffic. You think a robot car is going to get a kid out of a seat with their backpack and lunch faster than a parent? The pick-up line is even worse, as the kids are individually dismissed after the driver has been authorized by the school staff.…

If you can allow your kids to "free range" just a quarter mile, then they could be dropped off in a much less crowded place.
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