Microsoft and Ballmer not getting the iPad • Hacker News Board

Re: Microsoft and Ballmer not getting the iPad

#31

Post by TotlolRon » Sat, Jul 31, 2010, 4:07 PM UTC

extension wrote: post #28

The iPad is not a computer. The iPad is not a computer. Say it with me, Microsoft. Join in, half the tech industry. Nobody framed it better than Apple themselves at the iPad launch. On the big screen was an iPhone, a MacBook, and in between them, an iPad. Steve called it a new category, and that wasn't just marketing speak. It really is a new kind of gadget, designed to make you do things that you previously did not…

The iPad IS a computer.

It is at the time when the definition of a word changes that the greatest oppertunities present themselves.

There is no iPad market, there is no tablet market - there is a computer market. This is what MS is up against...

[Sent from my iPod touch]

Re: Microsoft and Ballmer not getting the iPad

#32

Post by epochwolf » Sat, Jul 31, 2010, 4:08 PM UTC

arethuza wrote: post #23

wazoox wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. Any pointer about this, a demonstration perhaps? Would it work as a web app?

Only if you can work out a really slick way to take screenshots from a web application.

ActiveX! (If it can hijack a computer, it can surely take a screenshot)

Re: Microsoft and Ballmer not getting the iPad

#33

Post by DougBTX » Sat, Jul 31, 2010, 4:19 PM UTC

extension wrote: post #28

The iPad is not a computer. The iPad is not a computer. Say it with me, Microsoft. Join in, half the tech industry. Nobody framed it better than Apple themselves at the iPad launch. On the big screen was an iPhone, a MacBook, and in between them, an iPad. Steve called it a new category, and that wasn't just marketing speak. It really is a new kind of gadget, designed to make you do things that you previously did not…

s/computer/desktop computer/g

Re: Microsoft and Ballmer not getting the iPad

#34

Post by felixmar » Sat, Jul 31, 2010, 4:22 PM UTC

extension wrote: post #28

The iPad is not a computer. The iPad is not a computer. Say it with me, Microsoft. Join in, half the tech industry. Nobody framed it better than Apple themselves at the iPad launch. On the big screen was an iPhone, a MacBook, and in between them, an iPad. Steve called it a new category, and that wasn't just marketing speak. It really is a new kind of gadget, designed to make you do things that you previously did not…

One thing that surprised me after using an iPad for a while is that the web is starting to feel old. I now see bloated web pages everywhere. Unnecessary widgets, links, icons, useless side columns, actual content making up a quarter of the screen. Information overload. I am now regularly imagining how a site i visit would be better as an iPad app. Applications like Flipboard have created new expectations how content could be consumed.

Re: Microsoft and Ballmer not getting the iPad

#35

Post by acon » Sat, Jul 31, 2010, 4:30 PM UTC

felixmar wrote: post #34

extension wrote: post #28

The iPad is not a computer. The iPad is not a computer. Say it with me, Microsoft. Join in, half the tech industry. Nobody framed it better than Apple themselves at the iPad launch. On the big screen was an iPhone, a MacBook, and in between them, an iPad. Steve called it a new category, and that wasn't just marketing speak. It really is a new kind of gadget, designed to make you do things that you previously did not…

One thing that surprised me after using an iPad for a while is that the web is starting to feel old. I now see bloated web pages everywhere. Unnecessary widgets, links, icons, useless side columns, actual content making up a quarter of the screen. Information overload. I am now regularly imagining how a site i visit would be better as an iPad app. Applications like Flipboard have created new expectations how content…

I have also feel that the web has become bloated and overloaded. I don't see what this has to do with the iPad. What I would like to see is a revival of the web with structural markup, fluid layouts and a minimum of distractions.

Is there anything about what you need to do which can only be done on an iPad? Such a revival is easier on a new platform where you don't know what to expect yet. However, I don't see anything which would prevent someone bold enough from cleaning up their part of the web.

Re: Microsoft and Ballmer not getting the iPad

#36

Post by mishmash » Sat, Jul 31, 2010, 4:35 PM UTC

sprout wrote: post #30

dotcoma wrote: post #6

it doesn't come as a surprise, given that they didn't get neither the iPod nor the iPhone...

Actually, from the two people I know who actually owned a Zune (and from Jerry Holkins: http://www.penny-arcade.com/2009/5/15/ ), Microsoft did in fact 'get' the iPod, and outdid it in a lot of ways. Microsoft just has shitty marketing. But maybe that's what you meant.

> Microsoft did in fact 'get' the iPod, and outdid it in a lot of ways.

Microsoft was over 5 years (1848 days) later than Apple to "get" what an MP3 player was. During that five years, Microsoft had a total R&D budget of over $25 billion, or $13,698,630/calendar day.

Of course we don't know how much of that budget was allocated for the Zune, but one could easily imagine it being in the hundreds of millions.

You say they got the MP3 player, I say if you throw enough money at a problem, eventually, no matter how hard you try to ignore it, the solution will present itself. And in this case, it was simply to copy their competitors.

edit: typo

Re: Microsoft and Ballmer not getting the iPad

#37

Post by msy » Sat, Jul 31, 2010, 4:36 PM UTC

acon wrote: post #35

felixmar wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing that surprised me after using an iPad for a while is that the web is starting to feel old. I now see bloated web pages everywhere. Unnecessary widgets, links, icons, useless side columns, actual content making up a quarter of the screen. Information overload. I am now regularly imagining how a site i visit would be better as an iPad app. Applications like Flipboard have created new expectations how content…

I have also feel that the web has become bloated and overloaded. I don't see what this has to do with the iPad. What I would like to see is a revival of the web with structural markup, fluid layouts and a minimum of distractions. Is there anything about what you need to do which can only be done on an iPad? Such a revival is easier on a new platform where you don't know what to expect yet. However, I don't see anythi…

No, but the recent spate of apps that take user experience when accessing third party content very seriously shows how utterly painful most of the normal web is. I think with first-party content providers it's also that if they're getting paid, they at the very least cut the ads down from eye-gouge to simply irritating, which helps as well.

I think maybe the point is that while there's nothing technically special about the platform, at the high end its developers are in a league of their own when it comes to UI. This is of course a distilled version of the entire Apple developer culture, which has always taken this stuff more seriously than Windows and certainly *nix.

Re: Microsoft and Ballmer not getting the iPad

#38

Post by Flemlord » Sat, Jul 31, 2010, 4:37 PM UTC

This is crazy talk. Microsoft needs a Windows compatible OS so they can leverage the millions of windows applications already written. To start from scratch would give up one of their main advantages. Best to stick with Windows, and focus on optimizing Windows 8 and Office 2012 for the tablet form factor. I love my iPad but I'd be willing to take a half-step back to a Windows tablet if it meant I could run Microsoft Office and other applications I need for my workflow.

I think MS Office is much better positioned for tablets than most people realize. Ribbon strips provide friendly finger-sized buttons that are perfectly sized for tablets. If they can add media center and some sort of X-Box gaming they'll have a killer device. Granted, Apple will still own the "consumption device" market but there is a big need for "business tablets".

Re: Microsoft and Ballmer not getting the iPad

#39

Post by shortformblog » Sat, Jul 31, 2010, 4:54 PM UTC

Flemlord wrote: post #38

This is crazy talk. Microsoft needs a Windows compatible OS so they can leverage the millions of windows applications already written. To start from scratch would give up one of their main advantages. Best to stick with Windows, and focus on optimizing Windows 8 and Office 2012 for the tablet form factor. I love my iPad but I'd be willing to take a half-step back to a Windows tablet if it meant I could run Microsoft…

Their history with Windows is not an advantage if the design of it is cumbersome and full of compromises. Which, more than anything, is what the point of the article is getting at.

Microsoft has had a decade of chances in this market to pull off the "business tablet" market you're suggesting. And, well, they just haven't done it yet.

If this is such a competitive advantage, why wasn't the iPad put on a Mac OSX architecture? Sometimes, an interface reboot is downright necessary. The Xbox 360, I'd argue, is the most successful non-Windows-related product they sell because it's clear that the interface design was tailored for the product.

That's their problem. They don't know when to let go of their legacy and start fresh.

Re: Microsoft and Ballmer not getting the iPad

#40

Post by megaman821 » Sat, Jul 31, 2010, 5:04 PM UTC

The weird thing is that Microsoft seems to have all the pieces necessary. If they just make a new shell the multi-touch, gestures, system-wide search, etc, etc is already there. WPF apps are probably easy ports since they are coded in a pretty semantic way. How hard could be to make a shell inspired by the Metro UI scheme?