Chuck Moore, Extreme Programmer • Hacker News Board

Re: Chuck Moore, Extreme Programmer

#181

Post by lobf » Sat, Nov 04, 2017, 1:07 AM UTC

RingwormOne wrote: post #178

lobf wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What types of diversity can you have amongst racially, socially, and economically homogenous people? What are you talking about? What is your grand, open-minded idea that ignores what actual diversity is?

I'm glad you asked! Diversity in musical tastes, religious and political ideology and affiliation, food preference (because new cuisine is always great to discover), experiences as a result of living in a primarily rural vs urban setting, occupational diversity, etc etc. I could go on. You care about diversity in things that don't really matter. When I walk into a room full of people I don't really care about their i…

1 point by lobf 1 hour ago | edit | delete [-]

I'm very sorry for offending you by not recognizing that "diversity in musical taste" provides for greater diversity than racial, social, and economic status. Silly me, I've been thinking about diversity all wrong. You're right, HN is very diverse- we have middle class white guys who like Metallica, and others who like show tunes. We have middle class white guys from suburban Iowa, and others from suburban Massachusetts. This is a very diverse website, I was very confused before.

>You care about diversity in things that don't really matter.

Race, social, and economic status don't matter. Musical tastes matter.

This place is so out of touch with reality. I'm glad I moved out of the bay area.

Re: Chuck Moore, Extreme Programmer

#182

Post by RingwormOne » Sat, Nov 04, 2017, 6:50 PM UTC

lobf wrote: post #181

RingwormOne wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm glad you asked! Diversity in musical tastes, religious and political ideology and affiliation, food preference (because new cuisine is always great to discover), experiences as a result of living in a primarily rural vs urban setting, occupational diversity, etc etc. I could go on. You care about diversity in things that don't really matter. When I walk into a room full of people I don't really care about their i…

1 point by lobf 1 hour ago | edit | delete [-] I'm very sorry for offending you by not recognizing that "diversity in musical taste" provides for greater diversity than racial, social, and economic status. Silly me, I've been thinking about diversity all wrong. You're right, HN is very diverse- we have middle class white guys who like Metallica, and others who like show tunes. We have middle class white guys from sub…

So you care about diversity in the color of someone's skin but not in what really defines them as a person? Or you think skin color defines people? And that all white people are pretty much the same? You're showing yourself to be quite racist.

Re: Chuck Moore, Extreme Programmer

#183

Post by e12e » Mon, Nov 06, 2017, 5:10 PM UTC

throwaway7645 wrote: post #165

hoosieree wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just want to say that it's awesome to see Rebol/Red and K mentioned in a comment thread about Chuck Moore. It's interesting because Rebol and K have almost totally opposite philosophies about how software should be structured. K emphasizes flat namespaces and leans heavily on the primitives and only a handful of functions. Rebol encourages writing DSLs to fit the language to the problem. But despite different philoso…

Agreed. Very different, yet similar philosophies if you squint hard enough. Aaron Hsu did an AMA on here and put it on YouTube showing his GPU compiler for APL code written in APL. The entire thing is maybe 5-10 pages of one-liners and looks darn elegant to me. During his lengthy talk on HN he shows you don't need zillions of abstractions if you can keep all the code in a few screens. He uses Notepad (not Notepad++ e…

Relevant hn link:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13797797

See also the top comment by Dang, with a link to the original thread.

Re: Chuck Moore, Extreme Programmer

#184

Post by e12e » Mon, Nov 06, 2017, 5:36 PM UTC

andrewla wrote: post #14

DonbunEf7 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He designed CPUs from scratch using a bare-bones minimal Forth (ColorForth) as his preferred way of writing code. The resulting chipset is utterly fascinating: http://www.greenarraychips.com/

> from scratch This is even understating it -- it's not like he used existing software to lay out the chip, and then ran tests using PSPICE to verify the functionality. He wrote his own chip design software and analog simulator, and designed the chip in his own environment, and created the CPU, the GA144: a working 144-core processor designed to run "ArrayForth", a parallel version of Forth that he designed and autho…

You're still underselling it; Colorforth is a traditional forth: it's the OS as well as the application[1] - it comes with drivers to write your progress to floppy disk.

One of my favourite blog post by Moore is where he builds up to generate the vga signal needed to drive his monitor from the ga-144. Sadly the code links are dead, even at archive.org - but the text remains:

https://colorforth.github.io/video.htm

https://web.archive.org/web/20160310112830/http://colorforth...

[1] https://colorforth.github.io/install.htm

Re: Chuck Moore, Extreme Programmer

#185

Post by e12e » Mon, Nov 06, 2017, 5:45 PM UTC

stefantheard wrote: post #15

andrewla wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> from scratch This is even understating it -- it's not like he used existing software to lay out the chip, and then ran tests using PSPICE to verify the functionality. He wrote his own chip design software and analog simulator, and designed the chip in his own environment, and created the CPU, the GA144: a working 144-core processor designed to run "ArrayForth", a parallel version of Forth that he designed and autho…

Your ending summary was exactly my thought process as I read the first paragraph. I essentially went through the 5 stages of grief as I realized I am no longer a developer.

"If I have not seen further, it is because I have been standing in the footprints of giants"

Re: Chuck Moore, Extreme Programmer

#186

Post by lobf » Mon, Nov 06, 2017, 7:44 PM UTC

RingwormOne wrote: post #182

lobf wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1 point by lobf 1 hour ago | edit | delete [-] I'm very sorry for offending you by not recognizing that "diversity in musical taste" provides for greater diversity than racial, social, and economic status. Silly me, I've been thinking about diversity all wrong. You're right, HN is very diverse- we have middle class white guys who like Metallica, and others who like show tunes. We have middle class white guys from sub…

So you care about diversity in the color of someone's skin but not in what really defines them as a person? Or you think skin color defines people? And that all white people are pretty much the same? You're showing yourself to be quite racist.

Right, recognizing race is one of the most important factors in deciding your status in this country is racist. Pretending race doesn't exist isn't racist.

Again, you guys are so laughably out of touch. This is a poe's-law level discussion.