Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Kremlin Cash Behind Yuri Milner’s Twitter and Facebook Investments

nytimes.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 204 posts

Re: Kremlin Cash Behind Yuri Milner’s Twitter and Facebook Investments

#71

Post by konart »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #18
EGreg wrote: post #17

Quick, investigate pg for Russia collusion LOL. But seriously, let's put these reactions in perspective. Supposs the same was revealed the other way, about a US company having ties to the US government investing in Russian technology. We wouldn't bat an eye. This hysteria about Russian collusion makes us waste our energy and attention which is necessary to pay attention to the real issues (which I list below.) I am n…

> Compared to what the USA does on a regular basis, Russia is a pretty good actor when it comes to external dealings It has been a while since the United States forcibly annexed another country's territory [1]. In any case, this argument is irrelevant. Irrespective of whether Russia is a "good actor" or not, they are a geopolitical competitor who surreptitiously exercised control over, or at least non-public purview…

>It has been a while since the United States forcibly annexed another country's territory

And why is this should be considered of any importance?

Re: Kremlin Cash Behind Yuri Milner’s Twitter and Facebook Investments

#72

Post by [deleted] »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #11
pinewurst wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is this surprising? When Milner came virtually out of the blue (or red, as the case may be) a few years ago, it seemed obvious that he was a conduit/laundry for oligarch cash at least. I even remember telling someone at the time that if we were chosen for YC, we didn't want Milner's dirty money. The additional Kremlin state ties seem only an additional technicality. (I mean the formalized acknowledgement of what…

> The additional Kremlin state ties seem only an additional technicality The line between investing for potentially-corrupt interests and acting at the behest of a geopolitical competitor is night and day. DST didn't just hand cash over to companies. They conducted extensive diligence and sat on Boards.

[deleted]

Re: Kremlin Cash Behind Yuri Milner’s Twitter and Facebook Investments

#73

Post by jryan49 »

malvosenior wrote: post #36

I’m having a very hard time understanding why anyone would be upset by the Russian government making technology positive investments. Especially technologists! I wish more money was deployed into software development. Russia seems to be a positive influence here.

So if blood money is used to invest in tech to clean it, and make them profit it's okay?

Re: Kremlin Cash Behind Yuri Milner’s Twitter and Facebook Investments

#74

Post by JumpCrisscross »

YuriNiyazov wrote: post #70
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> evidence that Kremlin gave orders to do X and not Y Again, you're moving the goalposts. Others [1][2][3] have directly responded to you on this point. Arguing that there is no need for alarm until some undefined threshold of red-handed evidence is attained is silly. If a state-backed investor invests in your company, and you don't know about it, that's cause for alarm in itself. It means you need to review, very ca…

In that case, I am really confused about what the point that's being made here is. > If a state-backed investor invests in your company, and you don't know about it, that's cause for alarm in itself. Is the only difference between today and yesterday is that yesterday there was no direct evidence that rich people associated ("backed by", "working in" - I am not sure what terminology you prefer to suggest nefariousnes…

> anyone who believed yesterday that Milner was not $funded (once again, insert preferred terminology) by the Kremlin is an idiot

Then more of us are idiots than you give credit for :). At the very least, I was an idiot and pg was an idiot [1][2].

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3143894

[2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3144475

Re: Kremlin Cash Behind Yuri Milner’s Twitter and Facebook Investments

#75

Post by malvosenior »

jryan49 wrote: post #73
malvosenior wrote: post #36

I’m having a very hard time understanding why anyone would be upset by the Russian government making technology positive investments. Especially technologists! I wish more money was deployed into software development. Russia seems to be a positive influence here.

So if blood money is used to invest in tech to clean it, and make them profit it's okay?

It’s funny that the people opposed to this keep using the “blood money” talking point. As if anyone knows the root source of the funds. Claiming otherwise is wild speculation.

Re: Kremlin Cash Behind Yuri Milner’s Twitter and Facebook Investments

#76

Post by jorblumesea »

Any money coming out of Russia is somehow related to Putin and his oligarchs. If you want to stop the Russian government from laundering money you'd need to stop trading with Russian companies in general. There's little separation between state and private interests. Money just doesn't come out of Russia at that level without the state being involved.

Regardless, it's likely this move was more financially motivated than politically. Diversification is the key to any portfolio and with Russia's economy tanking it was probably to ensure their billions stayed billions and wasn't held in worthless rubles or corrupt state companies.

Re: Kremlin Cash Behind Yuri Milner’s Twitter and Facebook Investments

#77

Post by jacobolus »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #74
YuriNiyazov wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In that case, I am really confused about what the point that's being made here is. > If a state-backed investor invests in your company, and you don't know about it, that's cause for alarm in itself. Is the only difference between today and yesterday is that yesterday there was no direct evidence that rich people associated ("backed by", "working in" - I am not sure what terminology you prefer to suggest nefariousnes…

> anyone who believed yesterday that Milner was not $funded (once again, insert preferred terminology) by the Kremlin is an idiot Then more of us are idiots than you give credit for :). At the very least, I was an idiot and pg was an idiot [1][2]. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3143894 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3144475

PG likely had a pretty good idea where the money came from (i.e. Russian mobsters/oligarchs with direct ties to Putin). But you don’t get to be a big-time VC by turning down giant piles of shady foreign money.

Re: Kremlin Cash Behind Yuri Milner’s Twitter and Facebook Investments

#78

Post by sgustard »

progman wrote: post #68

What if - theoretically - this is just "fake news"? I mean, how can you discern that the stuff the media reports is actually true, no matter in what direction? I think the most reliable source of information in this time of spreading "fake news" is personal witness by known people.

Of course you should make your own judgment of the validity of the source. In this case, it would seem to be a difficult task to invent all of this.

"The Paradise Papers is a global investigation into the offshore activities of some of the world’s most powerful people and companies.

The International Consortium of Investigative Journalists and 95 media partners explored 13.4 million leaked files from a combination of offshore service providers and the company registries of some of the world’s most secretive countries.

The Paradise Papers documents include nearly 7 million loan agreements, financial statements, emails, trust deeds and other paperwork from nearly 50 years at Appleby, a leading offshore law firm with offices in Bermuda and beyond."

https://www.icij.org/investigations/paradise-papers/

Re: Kremlin Cash Behind Yuri Milner’s Twitter and Facebook Investments

#79

Post by nether »

toyg wrote: post #28
pinewurst wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe that wasn't good phrasing. I'm trying to say that I never saw the division between those corrupt interests and the nation state they belonged to. I always felt they were acting in their national interests. What will be interesting here is how fast it falls off HN.

Already the title has been changed to take his name off.

Sigh. HN has always done this to reduce editorializing in headlines. You're an oldtimer; how are you unaware of this?

Remember your priors.

Re: Kremlin Cash Behind Yuri Milner’s Twitter and Facebook Investments

#80

Post by pheldagryph »

Senate Intelligence Committee has expressed concerns that Jack Dorsey is favoring the Russian government over the United States government.

Senator Tom Cotton, CIA Director John Brennan, transcript from Senate Intelligence Committee hearings on June 2016:

https://www.cotton.senate.gov/?p=press_release&id=414

SENATOR COTTON: I want to discuss cooperation with our Intelligence Community from Silicon Valley, specifically Twitter and a company called Dataminr. According to the Wall Street Journal from May 8th, as well as some other media reports, Dataminr which is owned in part by Twitter and is the only company authorized to access the full real-time stream of public tweets that Twitter has, recently cooperated with the CIA. But just a few weeks ago ended that cooperation. So our Intelligence Community no longer has access to Dataminr's information, could you comment on these reports?

DIRECTOR BRENNAN: It appears as though Dataminr was directed to not provide its service to the CIA Intelligence Community and so therefore, we need to be able to leverage other capabilities in order to make sure that we have the insight we need to protect this country.

COTTON: So those reports are correct?

BRENNAN: I am not going to dispute them.

COTTON: The Wall Street Journal also reported that the CEO of Twitter, Jack Dorsey, directed Dataminr to stop the contract because he was worried about the "optics" of helping intelligence agencies. Do you believe that to be accurate?

BRENNAN: I do not know his motivation for any corporate decision he may have made, but I have no basis to dispute that.

COTTON: The Wall Street Journal also reports that among customers of Dataminr remains RT, Russia Today, a propaganda outlet of Vladimir Putin's government, which Putin has said is "trying to break the Anglo-Saxon monopoly on global information streams." To your knowledge, is Russia Today a client of Dataminr?

BRENNAN: I believe so, I'm not certain of that. But I don't have any information that they have been excluded from their services.

Post reply on HN