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Freelancer.com has ruined my life

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Re: Freelancer.com has ruined my life

#21

let me piggyback on this thread. this is my freelancer.com experience as a hirer https://medium.com/@ss88/freelancer-com-my-horrible-experien...

Your article doesn't mention how much you paid them. If you are paying someone 5$ per hour, you can't expect much.

edit: you mention the prices in the comments, so here they are for anyone curious:

Node.js port 155 USD, Android port 789 USD, Website theme 300 USD. It is not slave wages considering the living costs in the respective countries.(sic!)

>Node.js port 155 USD

This is good for what, 1 hour of work?

Pay peanuts, get monkeys.

Re: Freelancer.com has ruined my life

#22
There’s a suspicious amount of “I’ll just leave those details out” in this article. That aside, this just goes to show why it’s important to work toward controlling your own destiny. That seems to be a theme here at HN, and for good reason. Your services will likely always be resold to someone, regardless of how high up the chain you are. However, the less layers above you there are, the lower your risk in ending up in a situation such as this one.

Re: Freelancer.com has ruined my life

#23
Ultimately, underlying all this, is a broken financial setup. At least I suspect so.

Transaction fees, liability, and regulatory-ish obligations are very high. The last one has been getting worse as "anti money laundering" standards are being beefed up to make financing terrorism & tax evasion (also money laundering to an extent) more difficult. It all results in weird rules and policies followed without a good understanding of why they exist. It's even hard to tell who's policy they, regulators/legislature or the companies themselves.

The whole thing has choke points (eg CC transactions) controlled by tiny oligopolies.

Anyone handling money-in-money-out from lots of parties ends up bureaucratic and skittish. Fraud, chargebacks and such are generally a big problem. On top of that there is always an incentive to screw around. For example, the average number of days between payment and withdrawal multiplied by daily transactions is a sum of money sitting permanently in freelancer's vaults. That spread also reduces all sorts of chargeback and fraud risks.

Anyway, all this boils down to a reality where no one but financial institutions can do a decent job of handling other people's money. Freelancer is handling this guy's money. His "salary" goes into a freelancer account. We've seen this problem a lot in startupland. Paypal, even though they are financial institutions. Ironically, the bitcoin exchange world and the MtGox thing. The online poker crisis of 2006...

It's a problem.

Re: Freelancer.com has ruined my life

#24

let me piggyback on this thread. this is my freelancer.com experience as a hirer https://medium.com/@ss88/freelancer-com-my-horrible-experien...

Indian developers are know for poor quality and extremely low prices. You probably shouldn't hire the cheapest developers.

> Freelancer.com is a cesspool of low-level coders who says yes yes yes when you ask them of their skills and knowledge of frameworks.

Yes it is. And you should avoid them, especially if you know this. Fool me once and all that. I think this experience is as much your fault as it is theirs.

Re: Freelancer.com has ruined my life

#25

let me piggyback on this thread. this is my freelancer.com experience as a hirer https://medium.com/@ss88/freelancer-com-my-horrible-experien...

Indian developers are know for poor quality and extremely low prices. You probably shouldn't hire the cheapest developers. > Freelancer.com is a cesspool of low-level coders who says yes yes yes when you ask them of their skills and knowledge of frameworks. Yes it is. And you should avoid them, especially if you know this. Fool me once and all that. I think this experience is as much your fault as it is theirs.

I didnt only hire Indians:

1 chinese, 1 indian, and 1 bangladeshi.

Re: Freelancer.com has ruined my life

#26

let me piggyback on this thread. this is my freelancer.com experience as a hirer https://medium.com/@ss88/freelancer-com-my-horrible-experien...

Your article doesn't mention how much you paid them. If you are paying someone 5$ per hour, you can't expect much. edit: you mention the prices in the comments, so here they are for anyone curious: Node.js port 155 USD, Android port 789 USD, Website theme 300 USD. It is not slave wages considering the living costs in the respective countries. (sic!) >Node.js port 155 USD This is good for what, 1 hour of work? Pay pea…

Well, the hour rate in europe is much higher than in Asia because the living costs are much lower.

So if you follow that principle, how is 155 USD low for 3 days work? its 1000 CNY

Re: Freelancer.com has ruined my life

#27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your article doesn't mention how much you paid them. If you are paying someone 5$ per hour, you can't expect much. edit: you mention the prices in the comments, so here they are for anyone curious: Node.js port 155 USD, Android port 789 USD, Website theme 300 USD. It is not slave wages considering the living costs in the respective countries. (sic!) >Node.js port 155 USD This is good for what, 1 hour of work? Pay pea…

Well, the hour rate in europe is much higher than in Asia because the living costs are much lower. So if you follow that principle, how is 155 USD low for 3 days work? its 1000 CNY

Why should the number be based on living costs? For assembly line workers with no skill requirement, yes. For engineers? Definitely not.

>So if you follow that principle, how is 155 USD low for 3 days work? its 1000 CNY

Let's see: Bangalore is (only) 5 times cheaper than SF.[1] So it's hardly 3 days of work. Shanghai is 2.2 times cheaper.[2]

1 - https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?cou...

2 - https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?cou...

Re: Freelancer.com has ruined my life

#28
I've heard of several people getting screwed over by Freelancer. I don't see them as being around too often. Maybe Upwork and others will displace them?

I recommend Open Door (https://opendoorconnect.com/) to market yourself as a consultant or contractor. It's appointment based so it's not a pure alternative to Freelancer but IMO task based sites aren't worth it for talented developers.

Re: Freelancer.com has ruined my life

#29
post #12

I tried Freelancer.com when I was starting out, I was really happy when I got my first gig, I did a good job, the client was pleased, I got paid an equivalent of £1 an hour but accepted that as my foot in the door... I tried to keep going down this route but quickly realised that this kind of competitive race to the bottom in terms of price is not just the the entry level experience, it's just generally expected. Thi…

Same here at vWorker. Did great work, ranked in the 100s, but it was not sustainable.

To top it off I got a job to implement a forex trading algorithm. He had a system to buy/sell on signals.

But when it came down to it, it didn't trade profitably. He wouldn't believe the code worked, and I couldn't convince him his scheme was flawed because it worked when he did it manually - and I've watched his youtube videos of him trading live. Obviously his scheme on paper didn't capture his feel for trading visually. (And I know now it is very challenging to make it work at all).

Went to arbitration and they decided I'd get 50% of the fee.

Re: Freelancer.com has ruined my life

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indian developers are know for poor quality and extremely low prices. You probably shouldn't hire the cheapest developers. > Freelancer.com is a cesspool of low-level coders who says yes yes yes when you ask them of their skills and knowledge of frameworks. Yes it is. And you should avoid them, especially if you know this. Fool me once and all that. I think this experience is as much your fault as it is theirs.

I didnt only hire Indians: 1 chinese, 1 indian, and 1 bangladeshi.

Don't the Chinese have a saying which means 'Pay low price, expect to get screwed over'? Bangladesh is even worse than India.
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