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A “Silicon Valley” actor is terrified by what’s happening in Silicon Valley

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Re: A “Silicon Valley” actor is terrified by what’s happening in Silicon Valley

#41
post #25

I got into a conversation once that I think frames this well. We had WILDLY different views on whether going to Mars was a good idea (like, violently polar opposite views). The strength of our disagreement surprised me. I was arguing that we should “race to Mars”, mainly because the value of having a second planet dramatically increases the odds of survival for our the human race, as a whole. Thus Mars is one of the…

There's enough straw in your comment to make an army of men, and almost too much cringe to handle.

For starters, you're putting a mountain of words in Kumail Nanjiani's mouth. It's odd that you must be told this, but when you use quotes to summarize your opposition's arguments, you're supposed to actually wrap them around words that were actually used. A quick Ctrl+F on that page leaves one having to guess at whether you're dishonest, careless, projecting your own securities, or all at once.

Then you go and draw a line in the sand and separate yourself from "regular" people who lack the capacity to see beyond their small and petty concerns. You applaud Silicon Valley entrepreneurs as holy warriors fighting for humanity's "best long term outcome" without providing a single example. You claim that people start businesses not to make money, but to save mankind itself.

All this grandiose talk while you fervently pat yourself (and your kind) on the back, but your only tangible anchors are imagined words and flimsy analogies to humans colonizing Mars.

You are the exact personality that Silicon Valley team expertly mocked in the first season.

"We're making the world a better place!"

And for the record, if you managed to get 5% of the human population on Mars, that would be ~350 million, more than the entire population of the United States. If we put that much energy into moving people to a planet that's currently capable of supporting life for zero humans, you'd think we could've built a pretty damn good defense system to knock asteroids off a collision course with Earth.

Why is it that so many people who describe themselves as forward-thinking are more attracted to the idea of terraforming a planet with a poisonous atmosphere than lifting a finger to keep our little oasis in decent condition? I'm not saying the entire human race should rise and fall on a single planet, but don't try to paint your Mars fantasies as an altruistic plan to save all the coarse-minded sheeple from themselves.

Re: A “Silicon Valley” actor is terrified by what’s happening in Silicon Valley

#42
post #4

I think that a better look at this subject is a recent piece in The Atlantic titled, "Are Facebook, Twitter, and Google American Companies?" https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/11/are-f... tl;dr, this back-and-forth is unsettling to a Federalist: >In response to a tough line of questions from Senator Tom Cotton of Arkansas, Twitter’s acting general counsel, Sean Edgett, gave two conflicting answers wi…

This is the second time that I read that WikiLeaks is classified as "hostile intelligence agency". Isn't the purpose of intelligence to gather information to gain advantage over adversaries? It sounds to me like a redundant term like "hostile military". And BTW WikiLeaks leaks are public so all other intelligence agencies and citizens can learn while state agencies try to keep things obscure as much as possible. Who'…

Wikileaks leaks are selective. "Public" only describes the things they release. The hostility is in the choice of releases.

Re: A “Silicon Valley” actor is terrified by what’s happening in Silicon Valley

#43
post #8

I think that a better look at this subject is a recent piece in The Atlantic titled, "Are Facebook, Twitter, and Google American Companies?" https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/11/are-f... tl;dr, this back-and-forth is unsettling to a Federalist: >In response to a tough line of questions from Senator Tom Cotton of Arkansas, Twitter’s acting general counsel, Sean Edgett, gave two conflicting answers wi…

But Kumail's point isn't about whether these companies are patriotic, he's saying they lack any ethical framework of operation and presumes it's because people aren't challenging each other with ethical questions preferring to condone any behavior in favor of flexing engineering muscles and proving that, "yes, they can". I don't think it's unrelated, and perhaps your point is that it's doubly clear no one has thought…

The social media companies (FB and Twitter) in particular seem to care nothing about the quality of their service otherwise they would be working to keep fake news and astroturfing campaigns off their platforms. I find that weird, or at least telling about how they feel about their relationship to users of the platform (yes I know 'the user is the product'). The lack of ethics need not be narrowed to a lack of patriotism as the lack of ethics is a problem globally for these companies. A sick individual could seriously fuck up any community through disinformation with enough time and resources. FB and Twitter are fully engaged enabling advertisers and care nothing about the messaging, content, or end result of any campaign as long as they get a hit off the impact.

Re: A “Silicon Valley” actor is terrified by what’s happening in Silicon Valley

#44
post #18

In the vein of Kumail's critique, if it's useful to anyone, I wrote some thoughts about software engineering and ethics from my own experiences: A serial tech entrepreneur in Silicon Valley once asked me to design a “social stockade” for his financial services customers. It would lock people out of their social media accounts and tweet out/FB share to their friends when they hadn’t paid a loan. He pitched it to prosp…

>Every software engineer I’ve worked with has had a strong sense of personal values and ethics, but the organizations we work for can take actions that are at odds with these. I’d like to highlight a few of the key challenges you’ll face and provide feedback for living your personal values. Most importantly, it’s critical that you think about the impact of your work and consciously set your personal values in advance…

Nuclear missiles, land mines, biological weapons, torture research, etc has all been carried out by willing and often motivated engineers or doctors.

I'm skeptical something that hasn't worked in other fields is going to fix our woes in software.

Re: A “Silicon Valley” actor is terrified by what’s happening in Silicon Valley

#46

I think that a better look at this subject is a recent piece in The Atlantic titled, "Are Facebook, Twitter, and Google American Companies?" https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/11/are-f... tl;dr, this back-and-forth is unsettling to a Federalist: >In response to a tough line of questions from Senator Tom Cotton of Arkansas, Twitter’s acting general counsel, Sean Edgett, gave two conflicting answers wi…

I hate wikileaks, but I honestly don't see the contradiction in Twitter's behavior on this point. Perhaps they were naive on whether RT was actually an aperture of Russian intelligence services. OK. Their KYC game could use some upping. OTOH, would anyone be surprised if the CIA were paying some little hedge fund somewhere to let them piggyback on access to Twitter's feed? As far as Wikileaks' uninhibited operation g…

the core issue is the activity focused on influencing a US election, which foreign nationals and foreign corporations are prohibited from doing [1]

if Twitter cut off CIA from firehose access and then tried to sell Twitter advertising and analytic services to RT for a US election then that seems to be some poorly constructed PR staging by Twitter

1. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/09...

Re: A “Silicon Valley” actor is terrified by what’s happening in Silicon Valley

#47
I've read the article and most of the comments here. Still not sure what ethically questionable things we're talking about. Is serving content related to your personal interests questionable? Or is collection of personal data for commercial (but benign and legal) purposes questionable?

I can see that selling and wide-scale distribution of personal data can be a problem unless explicit consent is obtained. Can someone clarify who's doing that and for what reason?

Re: A “Silicon Valley” actor is terrified by what’s happening in Silicon Valley

#48
post #42
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the second time that I read that WikiLeaks is classified as "hostile intelligence agency". Isn't the purpose of intelligence to gather information to gain advantage over adversaries? It sounds to me like a redundant term like "hostile military". And BTW WikiLeaks leaks are public so all other intelligence agencies and citizens can learn while state agencies try to keep things obscure as much as possible. Who'…

Wikileaks leaks are selective. "Public" only describes the things they release. The hostility is in the choice of releases.

They only publish true stuff, yes, but that's not normally what one means by 'selective'. They're not a hacking organization, they don't go around hacking people to obtain stuff. And yes, someone gave them some Russian stuff not too long ago.

Re: A “Silicon Valley” actor is terrified by what’s happening in Silicon Valley

#49
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, many engineers like to pretend their work is apolitical, but there is "No Neutral Ground in a Burning World"[1]. Everything is political, eventually; technology patently has political consequences that are large in scope, highly complex, and difficult to understand fully. When you are implementing a new technology, please take some time to actively consider all of the potential consequences you can thi…

The most overtly political act most software engineers are likely to make is to choose GPL over BSD or vice-versa. Walk away from a cool idea for ethical reasons? Risk their salary or their safety? I'm sure such engineers must exist, but they're not among any I've ever known. Unfortunately, I am rather pessimistic. We're in this Orwellian/Huxlean dystopia for a reason.

> they're not among any I've ever known

You just met one. In the mid 90s, when I was writing firmware and drivers for HIPPI[1] networking equipment, the Malaysian government bought a bunch of out hardware (indirectly), as part of a big system that was supposed to receive a bunch of TV channels from satellite, buffer it for a couple minutes on disk, and then re-broadcast the streams on local TV channels. The buffer, of course, allowed for the "live" TV streams to be censored on the fly.

This was before flash was cheap an ubiquitous, so the firmware for the FPGAs was on a socketed EEPROM. Changing the firmware required removing the chip and a computer with PROM programmer hardware. Bugs happened[2], and my boss decided I needed to make "our biggest customer" happy by flying to Malaysia with an --undeclared-- bag of EEPROMs with better firmware and personally updating their hardware.

It was my first "real" job, but I was still 3 more years of classes away from my bachelors, so I was getting crap intern wages of $11/hr. When I started to suggest I didn't really want to smuggle chips into an notoriously authoritarian state to help them censor their TV, my boss immediately offered me a 6-figure salary and a $60,000 cash bonus. I was seriously tempted. Instead, I gave them my 2-weeks notice the next day...

(side note: a few years earlier, the NSA offered me a full 4-year scholarship (inc. housing and cash stipend), but the "you just need to work for us for 150% time (6-years) after you graduate" price tag made that offer a lot easier to turn down)

[1] https://hsi.web.cern.ch/HSI/hippi/procintf/pcihippi/pcihipde...

[2] actually, it turns out our PCI interface chip was faulty[3]

[3] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10609033

Re: A “Silicon Valley” actor is terrified by what’s happening in Silicon Valley

#50
post #4

I think that a better look at this subject is a recent piece in The Atlantic titled, "Are Facebook, Twitter, and Google American Companies?" https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/11/are-f... tl;dr, this back-and-forth is unsettling to a Federalist: >In response to a tough line of questions from Senator Tom Cotton of Arkansas, Twitter’s acting general counsel, Sean Edgett, gave two conflicting answers wi…

This is the second time that I read that WikiLeaks is classified as "hostile intelligence agency". Isn't the purpose of intelligence to gather information to gain advantage over adversaries? It sounds to me like a redundant term like "hostile military". And BTW WikiLeaks leaks are public so all other intelligence agencies and citizens can learn while state agencies try to keep things obscure as much as possible. Who'…

"Hostile" as in "currently harmful to my political party".
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