Live data from Hacker News

Google is shutting down the QPX Express API for airfare data

news.ycombinator.com

91–100 of 197 posts

Re: Google is shutting down the QPX Express API for airfare data

#91
post #36

I was part of a team developing a travel product which needed huge amounts of data from flights to car rental... My god the travel industry is a mess in terms of accessible data. It was the biggest pain point. API's would randomly change structure, endpoints would stop working with unknown errors, data would be significantly different across companies for the same data etc... It was a shambles. Never again will I dev…

> Unless you own the data, working with it is terrible.

Heh. Having done work for an airline, I wouldnt even say this.

Re: Google is shutting down the QPX Express API for airfare data

#92

From [1]: "On April 8, 2011, the US Department of Justice approved the buyout (of ITA by Google). As part of the agreement, Google must license ITA software to other websites for five years." Now that five years are up, Google would want to deny competitors access to that data. Seems like a good startup opportunity. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITA_Software

> Seems like a good startup opportunity.

Last time this was brought up (2011 HN article IIRC), it was discussed how terribly organised the travel industry is and just how much Smart Work ITA did and how invaluable it was.

Re: Google is shutting down the QPX Express API for airfare data

#93
post #36

I was part of a team developing a travel product which needed huge amounts of data from flights to car rental... My god the travel industry is a mess in terms of accessible data. It was the biggest pain point. API's would randomly change structure, endpoints would stop working with unknown errors, data would be significantly different across companies for the same data etc... It was a shambles. Never again will I dev…

The car industry is another industry whose data is a series of nightmares. There are a number of services that aggregate inventory data for dealers using them. Sounds great, right? Maybe, if they had halfway decent APIs. Multiple providers--with zero connection to one another, I checked quite carefully after becoming exasperated--somehow managed to independently come to the decision that the best way to make inventory data available was to push large CSV files to an FTP server you setup.

Whatever. People can come up with crazy solutions and you're stuck working with them. At least you've got the CSV files by that point, right? Well, sort of. Turns out they needed a good bit of work. And by a bit of work, I mean that some of them were quite possible the worst CSV files ever generated. And it was...weird. Normally, if there's a problem with a CSV file it's at least consistent across the entire file. Quotation marks not escaped? Ok, no big deal. They're all like that. Usually, you can normalize the data and move forward.

If only. Some lines had escaped quotes. Some didn't. Some lines were actually multiple records because apparently the magic linebreak decided to go on strike. In one case, I kid you not, the file switched from comma-separated to tab-separated. Huh? How'd that even happen? Some values were perfectly valid, just handled in a way that's guaranteed to annoy the hell out of you. But fine. You do what you can, reject the bad (and log to a file for manual review in the hopes that you'll figure...something...out about it), and move on with your sort-of-normalized data. But that's just referring to the data itself, and not the entries.

When you order a new car, the build sheet for every manufacturer is simple enough. Every option has a code. Every option has a name. New car dealers get their inventory data back from the factory and it's plugged into their inventory management systems. Through whatever accidental acts of magic and chicanery, that data eventually makes its way to the data sources you're busy importing. Unfortunately, at some point in the process all of those beautiful factory codes and names--standardized, constant, etc.--disappear. That beautiful "Cobalt Blue" is somehow transmogrified into a very unhelpful "Blue." And don't even get me started on factory options. At times, you're lucky if you somehow accidentally get the basics like, oh, "has two front seats and possibly four-ish wheels." It's even worse with used cars, because some unlucky salesperson/clerk/receptionist/car washer kid had to sit down and manually enter the car data.

Instead of thinking of that giant CSV file as a wonderful list of thousands of cars just waiting to be discovered and purchased, you start to see it as more of a starting point. It's an incomplete list of cars for sale, with some of the information about each car. You need to use other sources to fill in some of the blanks, fix some of the most obvious errors, etc. Luckily, dealers upload their data to as many services as they can. Unluckily, it's often...different across those same source, and it's up to you to figure out what data to keep the same or change. Depending on the manufacturer, you can decode the VIN and pull up all sorts of useful information about how the car's build options. Maybe. You can then use the manufacturer's pricing guide for that model year to fill in the blanks. Assuming, of course, that you've got a copy of the pricing guide in question. Which isn't guaranteed, since they're generally not publicly available (though they do leak...often).

I'm a huge Porsche fan, and I know more Porsche fans. We're all nuts. Details matter. Do you want to know how many [shades of blue](http://paintref.com/cgi-bin/colorcodedisplay.cgi?manuf=Porsc...) Porsche has used over the years? Many of the paint colors are available across different models and different years, so the number is a lot scarier than it actually is, but there are a total of 641 entries in the linked paint database. Someone searching for a used Porsche wants to make certain that they're looking for a specific color or option. They don't want to just use "blue" for their search. They're looking for the gorgeous [Oslo blue](https://gearpatrol.com/2016/08/18/definitive-ranking-blue-po...) imprinted in their minds during a magical childhood moment, damnit. Which was only used in 1961, except for custom paint-to-sample orders in later years. There was 1 993 Turbo S in Turquoise Blue. Jerry Seinfeld bought it. A PTS color will affect the relative value of the car (new or used), so it's one of those fiddly bits that matters a bit.

You'll get another multi-gigabyte CSV file delivered to by FTP on the morrow. And joy, it's not an incremental update with just the new cars. It's all the cars they have data for. If a car has been sold, it'll be omitted from the file. It's up to you to figure out which. Hopefully, the car won't be "un-sold" in a day or two after the buyer backs out. That can get weird, especially when you're dealing with multiple providers. Finally, your simple diff is further complicated by the inevitable likelihood that random data across random listings has been changed as well. Perhaps they caught a typo in the VIN number, or the annoying fact that the paint color originally listed never actually existed.

Needless to say, I sound a bit crazy at this point. Your only option is to accept that, much as it might annoy the hell out of you, there are going to be serious compromises involved with the data you have access to. Apologies to those with sever OCD and perfectionists. Handily, some manufacturers have sites for their dealers (i.e., http://porsche-dealer.com). Usually, these sources are pristine with everything in order. You just need to scrape it where it's allowed, which is its own set of fun.

And don't even get me started on the photos included with listings. It's rare that you'll see decent photos taken by a dealer. Mostly, you'll find those on eBay Motors with certain sellers. Everyone else does their best to make them as terrible as possible. The data providers then take that as a challenge, and crush the ever-living hell out of the image with another round of JPEG compression and give the resulting monstrosity to you at a nice, small resolution. Want something bigger? Forget it.

Maybe I'm blowing all of this out of proportion. Perhaps the industry has changed in the past few years since my experience. Personally, I doubt it. In any case, dealing with this was annoying as hell. This rambling post was oddly cathartic.

Anyhow, if you ask me, I'm pretty sure all of the car search sites just scrape each other; like Ouroboros, depicting a serpent eating its own tail.

Re: Google is shutting down the QPX Express API for airfare data

#94
post #3

"You don't need to take any action. However, if you are actively using this product you may want to find an alternate solution before April 10, 2018." So, you do need to take action? That's a pretty terrible set of FAQs. They should at least provide a list of alternatives.

For anybody looking for an alternative, there is Fareportal, which has a full featured API for flights with both search and booking ability. https://www.fareportallabs.com/Home/DownloadDocs#0 I'm happy to answer questions as I'm helping several companies switch over to Fareportal at the moment.

What is Fareportal's pricing? I can't find it.

Re: Google is shutting down the QPX Express API for airfare data

#95
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet, there are still a lot of companies using and relying on Google APIs and cloud services. I don't understand why there is still so much trust in them after they've shown multiple times they will terminate services with little warning. And no, I don't consider 1 year a long enough warning for something that has no clear drop-in substitute. If you're using a Google service, you must be prepared for when they'll…

Isn't that true of ANY company relying on some service from some other company? What makes you so sure that this alternative service is more likely to stay around than one of Googles? The reason we think that Google EOLs so many more APIs than other companies is because Google itself is still around. Some other company's API wont be EOLd, instead they will just go out of business (or they will be bought by someone wh…

Also known as survivorship bias. You don't see the failed companies with dropped APIs because the company disappeared.

Re: Google is shutting down the QPX Express API for airfare data

#96
post #36

I was part of a team developing a travel product which needed huge amounts of data from flights to car rental... My god the travel industry is a mess in terms of accessible data. It was the biggest pain point. API's would randomly change structure, endpoints would stop working with unknown errors, data would be significantly different across companies for the same data etc... It was a shambles. Never again will I dev…

Ain't that the truth! I tried just messing around with it a while ago to make my own airfare searcher to check a few things for me and it was a mess. Ended up doing the Amadeus sandbox, but the cheapest flights aren't necessarily there and it's a real pita.

[deleted]

Re: Google is shutting down the QPX Express API for airfare data

#97
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet, there are still a lot of companies using and relying on Google APIs and cloud services. I don't understand why there is still so much trust in them after they've shown multiple times they will terminate services with little warning. And no, I don't consider 1 year a long enough warning for something that has no clear drop-in substitute. If you're using a Google service, you must be prepared for when they'll…

Isn't that true of ANY company relying on some service from some other company? What makes you so sure that this alternative service is more likely to stay around than one of Googles? The reason we think that Google EOLs so many more APIs than other companies is because Google itself is still around. Some other company's API wont be EOLd, instead they will just go out of business (or they will be bought by someone wh…

Are you going to invest into a company that has such an API its bread-and-butter, forced by finances to continuously improve it, or into a company that has it as a shiny new toy and throws it into basket when something else becomes more shiny?

Re: Google is shutting down the QPX Express API for airfare data

#99
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For anybody looking for an alternative, there is Fareportal, which has a full featured API for flights with both search and booking ability. https://www.fareportallabs.com/Home/DownloadDocs#0 I'm happy to answer questions as I'm helping several companies switch over to Fareportal at the moment.

What is Fareportal's pricing? I can't find it.

Price for API calls? Those are free for affiliate partnerships.

The flights pricing itself matches what you would find, for example, on CheapOair.com or OneTravel.com, which are driven by Fareportal's APIs.

Re: Google is shutting down the QPX Express API for airfare data

#100
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try kiwi.com? It's not as good I'm, but is fairly full featured. You can also use a spreadsheet to generate search urls for Google flights.

The features I most need are: routing options, fare class codes and multi-month fare calendars. Only Matrix has all 3 as far as I know. Often, when I call the airline to book a great itinerary I found on Matrix, the airline won't believe the time/price. I'll have to convince them to trust me and make an itinerary from the flight numbers. It's often faster and cheaper than anything on the airline's websites.

you've probably seen it already but bookwithmatrix.com is also very useful to get pricing based on ITA fare quotes.
Post reply on HN