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Facebook denies 'listening' to conversations

bbc.com

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Re: Facebook denies 'listening' to conversations

#91

Post by bhouston »

ojosilva wrote: post #89

But has anyone scientifically validated any of these assumptions? It doesn't seem very hard. Speak, then visit pages with FB ads and take note. Seems like the internets has taken these serious accusations as some sort of corporate conspiracy but I haven't seen any independent, credible study of how Facebook's apps (confirmed) access to microphone are actually being translated into ads.

Can not one decompile the Facebook app, or just somehow instrument it to see when it accesses the microphone feed?

Re: Facebook denies 'listening' to conversations

#93

Post by ceejayoz »

teraflop wrote: post #79
ceejayoz wrote: post #72

I'm inclined to dismiss it as confirmation bias, but I've had this experience personally - a conversation followed shortly by an extremely specific advertisement on FB shortly thereafter.

As suggested in the comments on Reddit, there's another possible explanation for this -- someone else in the conversation does a search based on what you were talking about, clicks on a result that sends tracking data to Facebook, and then the ads are retargeted to you based on a shared public IP address.

The last time I noticed this, it was a conversation between my wife and I, and I (we) poked around in her search history for that reason. Nothing that I could see, and it was within minutes of the conversation.

All that said, I still lean towards confirmation bias.

Re: Facebook denies 'listening' to conversations

#94

Post by ceejayoz »

noobermin wrote: post #80
ceejayoz wrote: post #72

I'm inclined to dismiss it as confirmation bias, but I've had this experience personally - a conversation followed shortly by an extremely specific advertisement on FB shortly thereafter.

I worry about facebook and all that and the state of privacy in the modern world, but a lot of these stories sound a lot like confirmation bias to be honest.

That'd be why I started my post with "I'm inclined to dismiss it as confirmation bias..."

Re: Facebook denies 'listening' to conversations

#95

Post by madeofpalk »

denzil_correa wrote: post #73

> "I run ads product at Facebook. We don't - and have never - used your microphone for ads. Just not true," Mr Goldman wrote. Personally, I am so used to corp speak and word play by major companies that it is difficult to take anything at face value. Therefore, I think the nature of the question asked to Facebook should be different. It should be on what they do rather do they do X. So, here's my question - "What doe…

How could they respond to remove all doubt they're listening?

Edit: https://www.theverge.com/2016/6/3/11854860/facebook-smartpho...

    In a statement issued on June 2nd [2016], Facebook said it "does not use your
    phone’s microphone to inform ads or to change what you see in News Feed."
That's pretty fucking clear to me.

Original comment:

If they had said something like "We don't use microphones to gather data to drive personalisation on users profiles" there would be comments here on HN complaining about corporate speak and how they didnt just flat out deny using it for advertising.

Apps get busted for doing dodgy things all the time. The Facebook app has been decompiled and network traffic inspected and studied so often that if this actually was true then it would have been proven by now. Instead, all we have is this weird 'survivorship bias' where one time someone said something out loud there was a tangentially related ad on FB.

Today I was looking up bars in Budapest and found one on Google. I started looking at images, at the only one that loaded so far on the slow internet was of food. "Wow, Google knows me so well. All I care about right now is food and the first image it loads is of food" I said out loud to my friend. Eventually the internet caught up and the rest of the images that loaded were of food. It only showed me food photos (in a bar thats more known for its decoration and alcohol). Nothing more than a coincidence.

Re: Facebook denies 'listening' to conversations

#96

Post by imroot »

A few weeks ago, I went into a Lenscrafters because I needed some cleaning wipes for my glasses. I have Wifi, Bluetooth, and Location services disabled for Facebook.

Someone messaged me on Facebook Messenger, I responded, put my phone back in my pocket, and finished the transaction, and then left Lenscrafters and walked down to the store that I was actually in the mall to see.

Within the day, I started seeing contextual ads for eyeglasses in my facebook feed, along with ads in other apps for eyeglasses.

I'm only suspecting that there's a service that does some flavor of ultrasonic beacon/listening technology, and facebook (along with DFP and the other large ad markets) are buying that service in troves.

Re: Facebook denies 'listening' to conversations

#97

Post by brad0 »

> "At work, happened to me though earlier this year. Working as a barista, got a burn, talked to my partner in person about it, went to Target, bought the burn cream, and saw an ad on FB for the exact product I purchased. Never searched for product either," wrote Brigitte Bonasoro.

Facebook has data sharing agreements with many, many companies. It's most likely that the cream was bought with a card then linked together with your facebook profile. It's not that hard, especially when you use the same email identifier for all those loyalty cards you have.

EDIT

A video that explains what Facebook does https://www.ted.com/talks/zeynep_tufekci_we_re_building_a_dy...

Re: Facebook denies 'listening' to conversations

#98

Post by notimetorelax »

feelin_googley wrote: post #90

It is interesting that they feel the need to officially deny it. The Twitter user co-hosts a podcast where users can call in to tell him whether they think Facebook is listening or not. One could argue, from a PR perspective, it does not matter whether Facebook is listening or not. First, some users do not trust them. Maybe Facebook is worried about those users telling other users. Second, some users believe it is te…

Hm... what about the expectation of privacy? I’m guessing in some states and countries this is illegal.

Re: Facebook denies 'listening' to conversations

#99

Post by codingdave »

The thing that frustrated me with Lance Armstrong over so many years was the smirk on his face when asked whether he used drugs, and he would reply, "Hey, I passed the test, isn't that good enough for people to stop asking?"

I suspect Facebook is falling in that same boat - technically following rules so they can answer questions the right way. But we're not seeing the smirks on their faces as they give that answer.

Re: Facebook denies 'listening' to conversations

#100

Post by cooper12 »

Overtonwindow wrote: post #76

I think the risk versus reward for Facebook and other companies is very high. All things being equal, I think it's more likely than not they will record things, will listen for words you say, and use that. The risk is enormous if it comes out with proof, but let's say they only listen a small percentage of the time, that kind of AI analysis is priceless.

I doubt it will make a difference to most people. The staunch pro-privacy stance really only exists on tech-savvy forums like HN. Go on reddit sometimes and observe how people will say "so what if Google has all my info, it's useful and free". If Zuckerberg calling his users dumb fucks for trusting him didn't get them off the platform, a "small" privacy violation like this won't either.
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