47 points, 122 comments.
flagged.
Yup, sounds like HN.
Reddit Bans Nazi Groups and Others in Crackdown on Violent Content
131–140 of 276 posts
Re: Reddit Bans Nazi Groups and Others in Crackdown on Violent Content
#132Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I go there and talk to the White Nationalists. They are pretty much Nazis. Nazi is a term loosely used today. Actual 3rd Reich Nazis commandeered by America & the Soviet Union after WW2. Wernher von Braun was a committed Nazi & was allegedly a willing participate in WW2 war crimes. See Operation Paperclip for more info. https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Operation_Paperclip > They are scared and powerless, looking for mea…
Hmmmmm weren't we talking about Nazis, not identity politics...
What's your definition of a Nazi? It's difficult to talk about a word that has a fuzzy meaning.
To some elements of the the modern left (i.e. Antifa), it seems like anybody who does not agree with certain ideologies, such as "Equality" (in the Identity Politics sense; again "Equality" has a fuzzy meaning), is equated with being a Nazi.
To paraphrase what I wrote above, the White Nationalist (aka "the Nazis") movement only gains followers due to the prevalence of Identity Politics being used to affect policy benefiting certain minority groups. White Nationalism is Identity Politics for White People; seeking to use politics to benefit White People and/or creating a white ethno-state. Are you seeing the connection?
Is this any different from groups such as La Raza, the Black Panthers, or any other ethno-state group? If so, how?
Re: Reddit Bans Nazi Groups and Others in Crackdown on Violent Content
#133Earlier quoted context omitted.
Fortunately reddit is banning communities that advocate violence, not communities with certain sets of politics. It just so happens that there's a major overlap of political views to inciting violence. Even the first amendment recognizes that there are limits to free speech- namely when they infringe on other people's rights.
Which political views would those be? Most of the politically-incited violence of the past few years has been left-wing. From Antifa, to the Berkeley riots, to the BLM riots (and BLM-inspired cop executions in Houston), and the "Bernie-bro" attempted assassination.
It was Dallas, not Houston.
>Most of the politically-incited violence of the past few years has been left-wing.
Is this claim based on data or anecdotes?
Re: Reddit Bans Nazi Groups and Others in Crackdown on Violent Content
#134Earlier quoted context omitted.
> But, they still deserve to express themselves freely. Um, why. What makes you think this. If someone's opinions are stupid and abhorrent, why should they not experience an immediate and firm response, in ban-hammer form. Why do you want to give ignorant idiots a platform to spread their ignorant idiocy to other ignorant idiots (and e.g. provoke easily influenced mentally ill idiots who might want to drive cars into…
Because we as a society have decided even the least among us deserve a base amount of human rights and freedoms and those aren't taken away without due process in a just society. I don't expect to change your mind. It's okay. I'm just really, really pro human rights. I've seen places with massive deprivations of rights. That's not okay.
You are encouraging people who aggressively believe in the restriction of rights (or worse) for large segments of the population.
It's one thing to say we can't silence them. it's another to say we have to listen, or give them access to any sort of private platform.
oh and I would be careful with these people. These bans started because one of these guys had an argument with his dad. He was freaking out and his dad called him a nazi, so he stabbed him. Some of these people are extremely troubled, potentially violent, individuals.
Re: Reddit Bans Nazi Groups and Others in Crackdown on Violent Content
#135It's really, really not easy to stand up for the rights of Nazis. If you're a Nazi, you can use voat.co as they are very free speech oriented. You don't have to be a Nazi to participate, but it's a good idea to have a thick skin if you do go there. I go there and talk to the White Nationalists. They are pretty much Nazis. They know I'm not white and that I don't agree with them. They don't scare me. They are scared a…
Technically, you're supposed to actually kill Nazis, since the US government (and many others) literally declared war against them. Anything short of that is just a gratuity towards them. Honestly, Americans aren't horrified enough by the mere existence of these people, treating them as an academic concept. If you actually know Nazis, you already know they're an extremely violent group. It took only a few days of me…
The United States declared war against the government of Germany, not "Nazis." It's in the declaration, twice:
JOINT RESOLUTION Declaring That a State of War Exists Between The Government of Germany and the Government and the People of the United States and Making Provisions To Prosecute The Same
... the President is hereby authorized and directed to employ the entire naval and military forces of the United States and the resources of the Government to carry on war against the Government of Germany
The responsibility for starting World War II falls squarely on Germany, not some udnefined group of national socialists.
Re: Reddit Bans Nazi Groups and Others in Crackdown on Violent Content
#136Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don’t want to nitpick your definitions, but nazism usually refers to the ideology of the NSDAP, a party that was disbanded at the end of WW2. You probably meant to say “violent racism”, in which case the comparison to antifa, and to a lesser extent blm, seems justified (they are linked by violence).
Nazism calls for the death and extermination of other people, antifa and BLM don't.
Sure nazism is 1000x worse than blm or antifa, the only problem is that nazism doesn’t exist anymore. The NSDAP was disbanded in 1945. Antifa and blm are still active today
> see a “nazi”, punch a “nazi”
> pigs in a blanked, fry them like bacon
Re: Reddit Bans Nazi Groups and Others in Crackdown on Violent Content
#137Earlier quoted context omitted.
>The problem is: where will the line be drawn? Intolerance, you draw the line at Intolerance. If BLM, PETA, Antifa want people of other race/class/sexual orientation harmed in any kind of way, sure go ahead and ban them. If on the other hand they want fair treatment, equality or reprieve from targeted brutality, listen to them and see how we as a society can address their concern. If they resort to violence, arrest t…
> Intolerance, you draw the line at Intolerance. Not that simple! "Intolerance: unwillingness to accept views, beliefs, or behaviour that differ from one's own". Does unwillingness to accept Nazi ideology make you intolerant?
>Does unwillingness to accept Nazi ideology make you intolerant?
Yes, Intolerant to intolerance.
Re: Reddit Bans Nazi Groups and Others in Crackdown on Violent Content
#138Earlier quoted context omitted.
Of course people are going to question your definitions when you've gone overboard in making one absolutely wrong and the others absolutely right. There's bad in both sets, which is why banning 1 group could have an effect on the other 2, eventually.
Well to be fair, one is entirely bad, jut to be clear thats the Nazis. There may be some rogue elements in the other groups who perhaps would use violence to further their cause but it is not their fundamental belief. Whereas Nazi ideology specifically calls for the extermination of others, neither of the other 2 groups are anywhere remotely near that position. There are no good Nazis. Sure there were some Nazis in W…
This is part of the problem with these debates that I've noticed: it's an attempt on the one hand to carry on the debate purely in terms of free speech, abstracted from the contents of any particular ideology.
And yet, part of what makes you "wrong" to oppose speech of particular groups is that you are just as bad as them. That's a judgment of the "wrongness" of a particular ideology, being directly appealed to, to justify a position on free speech.
For some reason that's supposedly not a slippery slope toward widening the scope of "free speech" to include things destructive of democracy.
Re: Reddit Bans Nazi Groups and Others in Crackdown on Violent Content
#139Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don’t want to nitpick your definitions, but nazism usually refers to the ideology of the NSDAP, a party that was disbanded at the end of WW2. You probably meant to say “violent racism”, in which case the comparison to antifa, and to a lesser extent blm, seems justified (they are linked by violence).
Nazism calls for the death and extermination of other people, antifa and BLM don't.
There are people in this thread claiming antifa and BLM are responsible for most violence in the last few years. The arguments being put forth by 'the other side' are not what you claim, and 'these folks' are going to couch their arguments the way they want.
Re: Reddit Bans Nazi Groups and Others in Crackdown on Violent Content
#140Amazing ( well, more like sad ) that the first comments I see are "well, we can agree that nazis are bad, but this is a slippery slope, what about BLM, and antifa" Nazism - The belief ( on pseudoscience i may add )that other races ( a term that has no scientific basis ) are only worthy of extermination ( death, MDK ) BLM - The belief ( on experiences of some in society ), that Black people are not treated the same in…
Antifa is certainly not anti-hate. They very much hate anyone that doesn't agree with their narrow-minded worldview, and they condone violence against those they hate. While they are anti-nazi, they are aligned with them in their level of bigotry and violence. Violence is never okay.