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Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

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Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#81

Post by Spooky23 »

logfromblammo wrote: post #8
frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #2

Sources said that HR department representatives told staff in one office they were being let go due to problematic "conduct with peers." When questioned, an ex-employee said, HR declined to specify any details about the alleged poor conduct, which had never been previously discussed. Is this pre-empting a union push?

It certainly is suspicious that people were fired "for performance reasons" when the company is unable or unwilling to provide the performance data that would support that assertion. But, on the other hand, these employees were probably "at will", so the company does not need to give any reason, or even to publicly justify the firings in any way. So it could be that "performance" is the lie that they believe to damag…

You can fire people for any reason, but there are costs involved in laying people off.

HR is a cynical business. Requiring stuff like training your outsourced replacement is also a strategy here — the longer you hang on to “undead” employees, the more likelihood they will leave voluntarily.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#82

Post by greglindahl »

ForHackernews wrote: post #76
ctdonath wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ponzi schemes don't produce major technological advancement. SpaceX made reusable rockets a thing. Tesla made great cars with bleeding-edge EV technology. SolarCity made "solar roof" a viable & aesthetic product. All three are still thriving on a lot of tech advancement. Long-term success remains to be seen in three very difficult industries, but current performance is certainly not the facades of Ponzi schemes.

> SpaceX made reusable rockets a thing. The space shuttle was reusable. It just wasn't cost-effective. So far, SpaceX hasn't proven their resuable rocket is cost-effective either. > Tesla made great cars with bleeding-edge EV technology. Model X ranked dead last in reliability: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/consumer-reports-survey-m... Model S owners have also complained about reliability and build quality probl…

There are tons of people on HN who post negative things on every thread related to Musk. Where's the problem?

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#83

Post by pdimitar »

- It's not mass firing. It's not even 4% of the workforce.

- So, employees were "surprised". As most people who are fired, ever, in any company and epoch. How is this news at all?

- Recalling 11,000 units might not at all be connected with layoffs. Implying otherwise is a cheap yellow press journalism.

- "Citing fears of retaliation from Tesla". Yeah, because Tesla definitely is known for pursuing people like they're some kind of a cold-war era vengeful spy agency. Sure.

- Some layoffs came 2 weeks early. Wow. Scandalous!

- Somebody made the mistake of over-stating how much personnel a new office is gonna have. Surely, this is news-worthy, right?

- Exact number of people laid off is unknown so hey, I have a genius idea, let's listen to the former employees who are now negatively biased against the company. I mean, they can't be wrong, could they?

And then the company tries to minimize the chance of former employees suing them. That's relatively normal if somewhat scummy, sadly it's a pretty classic state of affairs. Hardly exclusive to Tesla, though.

This "tech reporter" would do well to work with paparazzi. It'll match her journalistic expertise.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#84

Post by gozur88 »

hellbreaker wrote: post #75
11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #36

1,200 of 33,000 employees amounts to 3.6% of the work force. This level of action, 1 in 25 employees, gives managers an opportunity to release employees that looked good in the interview but did not meet expectations. Whether Tesla conducted this in a proper manner is open to debate and perhaps details will emerge if/when any former employees pursue Tesla in court. But any company needs to address the inevitable hiri…

Although I agree with you, you are also making an assumption that certain managers are not hiring mistakes as well. Managers can be just as bad as employees. Especially in a big company, bad managers can hide behind smoke screens by shifting the blame on employees.

Do we know there aren't any managers leaving? Where I work when they do this sort of thing only the very top layers of management are secure.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#85

Post by solaarphunk »

ghostbrainalpha wrote: post #22
mtgx wrote: post #11

If there was one division at Tesla that deserved lay-offs, surely it was SolarCity? I remember how everyone was talking about what a bad move Tesla made in acquiring SolarCity, because the company was a mess and unprofitable. I've also heard stories about how aggressive and pushy SolarCity's sales people were with customers, which ended-up giving the company an increasingly worse reputation.

Solar City was doing fantastic here in Las Vegas. There sales people were BY FAR the best when they came door to door. But Warren Buffet's power company changed the laws last year and basically screwed everyone who had solar. We have completely disincentivized putting solar panels up. Now the company doesn't do well, and no sales people come door to door from any company. If you are putting up solar in Las Vegas this…

Would you mind sharing a little bit more about Buffet's power company? Which one is it. Would love to read more about this.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#86

Post by gozur88 »

MikeTheGreat wrote: post #6
frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #2

Sources said that HR department representatives told staff in one office they were being let go due to problematic "conduct with peers." When questioned, an ex-employee said, HR declined to specify any details about the alleged poor conduct, which had never been previously discussed. Is this pre-empting a union push?

I remember a while back some .com company laid off a bunch of their employees (more than 40%? 50%?). Firing that many people at once triggered a set of 'lay off' laws, which required certain behavior from the company (such as giving the employees X days notice, etc, etc). This is pure speculation, but I wonder if Telsa is trying to do last-minute layoffs while avoiding whatever 'lay off laws' there are by claiming th…

Companies don't fire for cause very much. It's just asking for a wrongful termination lawsuit.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#87

Post by gowld »

moduspol wrote: post #65
11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #36

1,200 of 33,000 employees amounts to 3.6% of the work force. This level of action, 1 in 25 employees, gives managers an opportunity to release employees that looked good in the interview but did not meet expectations. Whether Tesla conducted this in a proper manner is open to debate and perhaps details will emerge if/when any former employees pursue Tesla in court. But any company needs to address the inevitable hiri…

Indeed. Calling 3.6% a "mass firing" to me looks like pushing a narrative.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Layoff

> "Mass layoff" is defined by the United States Department of Labor as 50 or more workers laid off from the same company around the same time.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#88

Post by gowld »

pdimitar wrote: post #83

- It's not mass firing. It's not even 4% of the workforce. - So, employees were "surprised". As most people who are fired, ever, in any company and epoch. How is this news at all? - Recalling 11,000 units might not at all be connected with layoffs. Implying otherwise is a cheap yellow press journalism. - "Citing fears of retaliation from Tesla". Yeah, because Tesla definitely is known for pursuing people like they're…

"Mass layoff" is defined by the United States Department of Labor as 50 or more workers laid off from the same company around the same time.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#89

Post by unethical_ban »

ForHackernews wrote: post #76
ctdonath wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ponzi schemes don't produce major technological advancement. SpaceX made reusable rockets a thing. Tesla made great cars with bleeding-edge EV technology. SolarCity made "solar roof" a viable & aesthetic product. All three are still thriving on a lot of tech advancement. Long-term success remains to be seen in three very difficult industries, but current performance is certainly not the facades of Ponzi schemes.

> SpaceX made reusable rockets a thing. The space shuttle was reusable. It just wasn't cost-effective. So far, SpaceX hasn't proven their resuable rocket is cost-effective either. > Tesla made great cars with bleeding-edge EV technology. Model X ranked dead last in reliability: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/consumer-reports-survey-m... Model S owners have also complained about reliability and build quality probl…

Comparing the shuttle glider to the boosters of the Falcon is completely inaccurate. Compare the SRBs and the main booster.

And yes, I think SpaceX has been working constantly to reduce cost of reuse of their boosters. Do YOU have proof, given their track record of improvements, that they are anywhere near as expensive as the Shuttle in terms of launch costs?

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#90

Post by gowld »

twoquestions wrote: post #66
wbl wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a surefire way to get hauled up before the NLRB. I'm not surprised companies try it, but they usually get sued for it.

NLRB still exists? I honestly thought the new administration got rid of that.

You don't think that would have been announced somewhere in the news, if it had happened?
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