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Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

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Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#71
post #15

Couldn't Tesla / SolarCity just said, "Hey, company didn't do well, sorry, here's 2 weeks severance"? Why do this whole "bad performance review" nonsense.

Because the stock price would drop and Tesla wants to do another round of funding (aka issue more stock) soon.

The stock price has dropped by $64 since the start of the week BTW. It was at $325 when I checked earlier today and came from a high of $389.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#72

I am pretty pro-union. However, in the case of Musk's enterprises, where there is this larger goal that is finally seeming to become possible, I am torn. I feel that anyone that works at these places should know and be a zealot for the Cause...but I suppose that Elon Musk probably should share his stakes with them a bit more, in that case. edit: I believe workers should be treated fairly, but I also want us to go to…

> However, in the case of Musk's enterprises, where there is this larger goal that is finally seeming to become possible, I am torn. I feel that anyone that works at these places should know and be a zealot for the Cause...

While critics often mock the “cult” of Musk, his defenders usually deny the characterization. You rarely see such an explicit acknowledgment and endorsement of it.

The honesty is refreshing, I guess, even if the content is appalling.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#73
post #18

This doesn't really surprise me. A few years ago we had lead generation software that catered to the solar industry. We had some decent sized clients and it did really well for about 2 years. Once the tax credits started going away and the power companies started killing off their rebates, a lot of these solar companies were not able to survive. One of our larger clients who was heavily funded went bankrupt this year…

I’m surprised. At the rate PV has been falling these subsidies are probably negligible (federal rebate withstanding). I purchased PV because the cost with a 20-year loan comes out to be 13c kWh, meanwhile PG&E charges 29c kWh. And the loan interest is tax-deductible.

What company did you use? I have received 3 quotes and none make much sense.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#75

1,200 of 33,000 employees amounts to 3.6% of the work force. This level of action, 1 in 25 employees, gives managers an opportunity to release employees that looked good in the interview but did not meet expectations. Whether Tesla conducted this in a proper manner is open to debate and perhaps details will emerge if/when any former employees pursue Tesla in court. But any company needs to address the inevitable hiri…

Although I agree with you, you are also making an assumption that certain managers are not hiring mistakes as well. Managers can be just as bad as employees. Especially in a big company, bad managers can hide behind smoke screens by shifting the blame on employees.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#76

SpaceX, Tesla, and SolarCity: ponzi schemes that have a little tech behind them and pull on our heartstrings.

Ponzi schemes don't produce major technological advancement. SpaceX made reusable rockets a thing. Tesla made great cars with bleeding-edge EV technology. SolarCity made "solar roof" a viable & aesthetic product. All three are still thriving on a lot of tech advancement. Long-term success remains to be seen in three very difficult industries, but current performance is certainly not the facades of Ponzi schemes.

> SpaceX made reusable rockets a thing.

The space shuttle was reusable. It just wasn't cost-effective. So far, SpaceX hasn't proven their resuable rocket is cost-effective either.

> Tesla made great cars with bleeding-edge EV technology.

Model X ranked dead last in reliability: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/consumer-reports-survey-m...

Model S owners have also complained about reliability and build quality problems.

I don't know much about SolarCity as a business, but the Tesla buyout has a lot of sketchy signs about it https://www.fool.com/investing/2017/10/18/solarcity-teslas-s...

I don't necessarily think Musk's companies are literally "Ponzi schemes", but they are less impressive than the hype surrounding them, and they all rely heavily on government subsidies.

I just wish HN would take the same critical eye to Musk that it does toward other business luminaries. It seems like far too many people are easily seduced by "Mars colony! Hyperloop! Rocket around the world!"

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#77
post #68
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Department of Labor usually investigates these things.

This is not your father's Department of Labor. I see little chance that any enforcement will happen.

What the hell does that even mean? When my father had trouble with his union doing illegal shit in the 1980s, the Dept. of Labor back then was useless, as was the NLRB, and when the trouble became to violent threats, the FBI was zero help, too!

I know you meant that as a veiled criticism of Trump, but here's the reality: The US government under Trump is getting itself turned around after decades of mismanagement. It won't happen overnight, but there are clearly much-needed reforms in progress and a lot of people don't like that. And the rest just take cheap shots because they simply don't know any better.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#78

I am pretty pro-union. However, in the case of Musk's enterprises, where there is this larger goal that is finally seeming to become possible, I am torn. I feel that anyone that works at these places should know and be a zealot for the Cause...but I suppose that Elon Musk probably should share his stakes with them a bit more, in that case. edit: I believe workers should be treated fairly, but I also want us to go to…

> edit: I believe workers should be treated fairly, but I also want us to go to Mars. If 1 prevented 2, I would be torn. Why should this earn a negative vote? I assume because this same argument, if you took it to ridiculous extremes, could be used to justify a whole range of terrible shit. Watch: "I believe workers should not be enslaved, but I also want us to go to Mars. If 1 prevented 2, I would be torn." "I belie…

I am not trying to create an axiom meant to generalize to all cases. I am just willing to be a little less pro-union (and this point has gotten lost here apparently) than I am usually when it comes to THIS set of companies, for very particular reasons. That is because I tend to think of these companies (at least SpaceX) more as causes than as companies. When you willingly work for a cause, you expect these things. If you are fighting to treat victims of war near battlefields, you might get be indanger, and the organization might not be able to do much about it, or provide you the kinds of benefits that would be deserving in a perfect world.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#79

Sources said that HR department representatives told staff in one office they were being let go due to problematic "conduct with peers." When questioned, an ex-employee said, HR declined to specify any details about the alleged poor conduct, which had never been previously discussed. Is this pre-empting a union push?

For cause terminated employees don’t get unemployment.

My guess is that since Musk companies don’t feel constrained by rules, they figure they’ll save money in UI taxes by forcing workers to adjudicate their UI benefits. They get the benefit of cooking their balance sheet as an additional benefit.

Re: Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity

#80
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the stock price would drop and Tesla wants to do another round of funding (aka issue more stock) soon.

The stock price has dropped by $64 since the start of the week BTW. It was at $325 when I checked earlier today and came from a high of $389.

That's not correct. $389 is its all-time high. It closed at ~$345 on Friday and opened ~$350 on Monday.
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