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Pingfs: A filesystem where data is stored as ICMP Echo packets (2016)

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Re: Pingfs: A filesystem where data is stored as ICMP Echo packets (2016)

#21
post #19

This reminds me of delay line memory, storing information in the echo of a sound: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delay_line_memory . LEO had long tubes of mercury for this, not sure I would have wanted to work in that office.

I think very few bits here are actually stored in-flight on the copper/fiber/radio at any time. Most of them are probably stored in various buffers of networking equipment (which are ordinary semiconductor RAM). It would be interesting to see someone do an actual breakdown for, say, a transatlantic link. My gut feeling says that only geostationary satellite links have any significant number of bits in-flight.

Very simplified, but assuming a 5000 km cable and 300 000 km/s speed of light (is slightly slower in fiber), light needs 0.01666... seconds for that. At 10 Gbit/s (fairly slow), that'd mean ~ 166 Mbit or ~ 20 Megabyte in flight. (I hope I didn't forget a factor 1000 somewhere)

Re: Pingfs: A filesystem where data is stored as ICMP Echo packets (2016)

#22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can fork it and port it to something like dokany to make it work in Windows.

Based on Annatar's profile, he'd like it to work on FreeBSD.

illumos and it’s the programmer’s “Linux only” attitude which irritates me.

Re: Pingfs: A filesystem where data is stored as ICMP Echo packets (2016)

#23
post #21
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think very few bits here are actually stored in-flight on the copper/fiber/radio at any time. Most of them are probably stored in various buffers of networking equipment (which are ordinary semiconductor RAM). It would be interesting to see someone do an actual breakdown for, say, a transatlantic link. My gut feeling says that only geostationary satellite links have any significant number of bits in-flight.

Very simplified, but assuming a 5000 km cable and 300 000 km/s speed of light (is slightly slower in fiber), light needs 0.01666... seconds for that. At 10 Gbit/s (fairly slow), that'd mean ~ 166 Mbit or ~ 20 Megabyte in flight. (I hope I didn't forget a factor 1000 somewhere)

Your calculation makes sense. However, for those 20 MB in flight, how much data is stored in buffers? I think that could be approximated by comparing ping time with speed of light.

e.g. if a 5000 km long link at 10 Gbit/s has latency of 0.0166 s, then you have zero buffering. If you have latency of 0.2 s, then around 2 Gbit of data must be stored in buffers somewhere, making 20 MB in flight only 1% of all data stored in such a ping filesystem.

Re: Pingfs: A filesystem where data is stored as ICMP Echo packets (2016)

#24
post #23
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very simplified, but assuming a 5000 km cable and 300 000 km/s speed of light (is slightly slower in fiber), light needs 0.01666... seconds for that. At 10 Gbit/s (fairly slow), that'd mean ~ 166 Mbit or ~ 20 Megabyte in flight. (I hope I didn't forget a factor 1000 somewhere)

Your calculation makes sense. However, for those 20 MB in flight, how much data is stored in buffers? I think that could be approximated by comparing ping time with speed of light. e.g. if a 5000 km long link at 10 Gbit/s has latency of 0.0166 s, then you have zero buffering. If you have latency of 0.2 s, then around 2 Gbit of data must be stored in buffers somewhere, making 20 MB in flight only 1% of all data stored…

How about the earth-moon-earth path for 768,000km?

EDIT: For the EME path that's around 3 gigs in flight

Re: Pingfs: A filesystem where data is stored as ICMP Echo packets (2016)

#25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like your looking for something like MangoDb https://github.com/dcramer/mangodb Note: joke assumes parent poster was somewhat humorous

nsafs might be another good choice: https://github.com/freedomtools/nsafs

That's innovative!

Re: Pingfs: A filesystem where data is stored as ICMP Echo packets (2016)

#26
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Based on Annatar's profile, he'd like it to work on FreeBSD.

illumos and it’s the programmer’s “Linux only” attitude which irritates me.

I get your sentiment in general but... you're upset because a tool for storing files in IMCP pings isn't available on your OS? Poor you, where else are you going to keep your files!

Re: Pingfs: A filesystem where data is stored as ICMP Echo packets (2016)

#27

This is exactly what I needed - not a lot of people are doing eventually inconsistent databases yet. If theres a network partition, shits probably fucked anyways so its best to throw away all your data. Unfortunately the metadata (list of files) is stored in memory, not network. Not quite as unreliable as I would like.

Sounds like your looking for something like MangoDb https://github.com/dcramer/mangodb Note: joke assumes parent poster was somewhat humorous

Obligatory: "Tokutek claims to improve MongoDB performance 20x. It is unclear if this also means losing 20x as many documents."

Re: Pingfs: A filesystem where data is stored as ICMP Echo packets (2016)

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like your looking for something like MangoDb https://github.com/dcramer/mangodb Note: joke assumes parent poster was somewhat humorous

nsafs might be another good choice: https://github.com/freedomtools/nsafs

I didn't realize there were so many of these jokefs projects.

It's like the software dev equivalent of those silly domain jokes:

https://helenkellersimulator.org/

http://motherfuckingwebsite.com/

http://thingsididlastnight.com/

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