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Analyzing HN moderation and censorship

drewdevault.com

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Re: Analyzing HN moderation and censorship

#241

Post by rukuu001 »

avip wrote: post #240
andrewguenther wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've found moderation on HN to be a bit heavy handed recently. Specifically when it comes to the issue of sexism in SV. No matter the opinion, posts on this seem to get removed shortly after reaching the front page. Question for the mods: Why? It doesn't appear to be a bias towards either side. Is the perception just that people are tied of hearing about it? Why not let the users decide that?

Great. Let's keep this place technical. How is "sexism in SV" of any interest to a global tech-focused community?

Besides the oft-quoted HN submission guidelines, another answer to your question is that women are usually the ones affected by sexism, and women read HN (no, really).

Re: Analyzing HN moderation and censorship

#242

Post by stcredzero »

flavio81 wrote: post #78

In this thread, some people are complaining of moderators downvoting (lowering the rank) of some submissions over others; and at least one person says "let the readers decide". I think that if I wanted a forum/news site where "the readers decide" and ONLY the readers decide, i'd go to Reddit. No thanks, i prefer HN due to the behind-the-scenes 'curation' or choice of content, which so far usually gives very interesti…

I think that if I wanted a forum/news site where "the readers decide" and ONLY the readers decide, i'd go to Reddit.

Some of the most heavy-handed moderation I've seen lately has been on some subreddits.

Re: Analyzing HN moderation and censorship

#243

Post by brudgers »

mbesto wrote: post #217
tptacek wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are no paid submissions to HN, nor is there an elaborate conspiracy between HN and "certain media orgs" to get paywalled links onto the front page. This is the sort of nonsense tangent crud that the mods would normally zap to the bottom of the thread as "off topic". But they probably won't here, because it concerns their own moderation, and they're generally loathe to intervene --- even to clean up the threads…

> There are no paid submissions to HN I don't mean to derail your point (because it's valid) but I don't believe this statement is true. YC companies can pay[0] to get recruitment posts on the frontpage of HN. [0]Note - I'm almost certain YC companies pay for this in some form (wether by cash or some other form) and would be happy for a YC company to confirm/deny.

I think that posting jobs directly to HN is another perk of being a YC company. As noted in the article, the mods can provide a definitive answer.

For what it is worth:

+ I suspect the value of one good hire for one YC company is potentially orders of magnitude more money to YC than whatever it would charge companies multiplied by all the possible times all the YC companies might pay it.

+ The revenue model of YC does not appear to include charging 'incubation' fees to the companies in its portfolio. To the degree this is true it differentiates YC from many other companies in the business of funding startups in batches and providing early stage support and advice. Again, I suspect this is because YC expects the return value of its investment to correlate with the length of runway a startup has and taking fees shortens the runway.

But I am speculating and could be wrong.

Re: Analyzing HN moderation and censorship

#244

Post by enraged_camel »

rukuu001 wrote: post #241
avip wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great. Let's keep this place technical. How is "sexism in SV" of any interest to a global tech-focused community?

Besides the oft-quoted HN submission guidelines, another answer to your question is that women are usually the ones affected by sexism, and women read HN (no, really).

It's another example of women being sidelined. Most HN readers are male, and selfishly flag/downvote articles/comments about sexism because they want to read about the latest JavaScript framework instead.

Re: Analyzing HN moderation and censorship

#245

Post by jsmthrowaway »

tptacek wrote: post #50
angersock wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How so? HN is run by YC, and HN is used to promote YC companies and attract talent and normalize YC-style startup culture. Please elaborate before being so dismissive--you know, like we used to do on old HN.

I wrote a longer comment, originally, but cut it back to the single sentence when I realized that by dignifying the argument I was only lending your tossed-off slur more credibility. HN is not moderated so as to be agitprop for YC. Nobody who's talked to Dan for more than a couple minutes, or watched this site discuss the SFBA tech industry, could believe that. The difference between the site post-Dan and pre-Dan ---…

Rank penalization is alive and well in the dang era, I assure you. It's variously applied to my entire account, and I was penalized so heavily at one point that I appeared below every gray comment. Lately, it seems to oscillate with no rhyme or reason.

> Yes, your account has a penalty that accounts get when they post too many low-quality comments--specifically ones that are uncivil and/or unsubstantive and/or tediously argumentative.

That's how it was explained to me, by Dan. He didn't stop the practice, and I'd contend he's probably doubled down on it.

Re: Analyzing HN moderation and censorship

#246

Post by mnglkhn2 »

tptacek wrote: post #131
mnglkhn2 wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem quite sure! Are you part of the HN executive group?

You figured me out! I'm the Executive Vice Chairman In Charge Of User Acquisition Metrics. Ewige Blumenkraft!

Not sure if you're answering in good faith or if it is just a put down. I'll take it as a valid one. Good for you!

Re: Analyzing HN moderation and censorship

#247

Post by brad_chad »

eropple wrote: post #156
tptacek wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plenty of people who are deeply concerned about sexism in this industry also flag those stories, because it only takes 2-3 misogynist trolls to create a 300-comment shitshow out of them. There are still kinds of threads that this site simply can't do well, and it's better we not pretend we can until the guidelines and mod tools evolve to actually make them work here.

And, to underline, we have a lot more than 2-3 misogynist trolls in these parts. Reflexive rich-white-dude defensiveness is perhaps HN's greatest challenge.

Comments like this are as bad as the comments by misogynist trolls. They're just coming from an equal (measured by inflammation) but opposite ideology.

Re: Analyzing HN moderation and censorship

#248

Post by beingmyself2 »

ahdiheje wrote: post #88

I am being auto shadow banned. Just look at dead comments to know how heavy moderated opinion is on HN. HN controls what views they allow on their forum, certainly not a place to have a free and open discussion.

I've noticed over the years that comments seem to be moderated with political bias. I've been shadowbanned before for expressing conservative viewpoints (without breaking rules). Mods like their echochambers.

Re: Analyzing HN moderation and censorship

#249

Post by beingmyself2 »

chasing wrote: post #15
vormalpg wrote: post #9

Moderators should in no way be able to bury posts or even nudge them downwards. This is a cowardly way to try to control discussion. If it isn't explicitly against the site rules, let the readers decide.

It's a private space and they want to promote a certain kind of discussion. It's not cowardly at all.

shadowbanning is cowardly and cruel. If internet bullying is a thing then this is an example of such.

Re: Analyzing HN moderation and censorship

#250

Post by tptacek »

mbesto wrote: post #236
tptacek wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From conversations I've had with YC founders, I do not believe this is the case.

So how exactly do they get recruitment posts on the frontpage?

All the YC startups get access to a queue of new job postings that run on the site.
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