Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Just own the damn robots

thereformedbroker.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

231–240 of 356 posts

Re: Just own the damn robots

#231

Post by mlrtime »

hectorlorenzo wrote: post #196
Waterluvian wrote: post #98

Reads like this are slowly convincing me not to buy into the world of mortgages and debt and to just live the rest of my life paying for everything in cash. I tried to buy a house last year with my wife but the market exploded where I live and suddenly houses were 40% more expensive from last year. So we still rent, which makes me feel incomplete. Like I'm kind of failing my duty of bringing the Canadian Dream to my…

Slightly off-topic, but that is the main reason I do not want to have kids: I am not sure I would like the kind of person I would become. Sometimes I am already paralysed by fear when thoughts about my future take a dark turn (relatively often), but at the end of the day it is my well-being (and my wife's) we are talking about, and we are economically independent adults. We could take a hit or two. Throwing little de…

If you have this mindset then you are already ready for kids. The people that aren't ready don't even think about it.

Re: Just own the damn robots

#232

Post by hectorlorenzo »

mlrtime wrote: post #231
hectorlorenzo wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slightly off-topic, but that is the main reason I do not want to have kids: I am not sure I would like the kind of person I would become. Sometimes I am already paralysed by fear when thoughts about my future take a dark turn (relatively often), but at the end of the day it is my well-being (and my wife's) we are talking about, and we are economically independent adults. We could take a hit or two. Throwing little de…

If you have this mindset then you are already ready for kids. The people that aren't ready don't even think about it.

I hope there's a third way: ready for kids, still don't want to have any!

Re: Just own the damn robots

#233

Post by brbrodude »

explainplease wrote: post #222
PhasmaFelis wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's depressing how many people aren't interested in understanding how and why communism failed, and what we can learn from that. The conclusion is always just "capitalism and communism are the only two systems that exist; communism didn't work; therefore capitalism is the best and only way to run things."

I think it's helpful to look at it in terms of control vs. freedom. Communism means more state control of people, capitalism means less. In these terms, what if capitalism is simply the natural outcome of x amount of freedom? Therefore, shifting away from capitalism means shifting toward either anarchy or communism (even if both of those options are far away in absolute distances). This makes it hard to discuss thing…

It's a fallacious distinction. That's not what each one means.

Re: Just own the damn robots

#234

Post by Digit-Al »

arca_vorago wrote: post #154

Have fun trying to own the robots after we've allowed proprietary licenses and leasing to takeover anything with a CPU attached. Ownership is important, which is why copyleft is important, and its time to recognize how integral the four freedoms are to the future I think most of us want.

He wasn't talking about actually, physically, owning the robots. He was talking about owning stocks in the companies that make the robots. So that as they get wealthier, so do you.

Re: Just own the damn robots

#235

Post by sulam »

davidiach wrote: post #221
matthewbauer wrote: post #79

Interesting article but I think the premise that workers are buying tech stocks because they fear automation is incorrect. Gallup found 13% of Americans thought that their jobs would soon be replaced by automation[1]. In fact you usually find more people worried about immigration than automation[2]. Maybe people /should/ be more concerned about automation but they just aren’t right now. [1]: http://news.gallup.com/po…

I think the reason people are not excited is because we are seeing stock market growth without seeing much economic growth. That's unsustainable.

If we continue to make holding cash unprofitable, those who earn money will invest in equities. The length of our current economic cycle is inversely correlated with GDP growth.

Re: Just own the damn robots

#236

Post by explainplease »

brbrodude wrote: post #233
explainplease wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's helpful to look at it in terms of control vs. freedom. Communism means more state control of people, capitalism means less. In these terms, what if capitalism is simply the natural outcome of x amount of freedom? Therefore, shifting away from capitalism means shifting toward either anarchy or communism (even if both of those options are far away in absolute distances). This makes it hard to discuss thing…

It's a fallacious distinction. That's not what each one means.

By "means" I mean "necessarily results in," not "is defined as."

If after my clarifying that you still disagree, please explain, otherwise what's the point of saying so?

Re: Just own the damn robots

#237

Post by toasterlovin »

bamboozled wrote: post #202
hectorlorenzo wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slightly off-topic, but that is the main reason I do not want to have kids: I am not sure I would like the kind of person I would become. Sometimes I am already paralysed by fear when thoughts about my future take a dark turn (relatively often), but at the end of the day it is my well-being (and my wife's) we are talking about, and we are economically independent adults. We could take a hit or two. Throwing little de…

This seems to be a pretty common attitude amongst a lot of people in their late twenties and early thirties I socialise with (who should probably be well into parenthood). Common question seems to be, "Why bring a child into a world facing climate change, potential nuclear war and a lack of prosperity or opportunities for personal growth". Adopting is probably a better option ;)

On the other hand, maybe let your kids decide if life is worth living. Seems wrong to make that decision for them...

Re: Just own the damn robots

#238

Post by sulam »

This “theory” for equities growth is a joke. There is a very simple reason for it and plenty of non-tech baskets show the same 2 yr (or longer) pattern.

Simply put, cash and cash equivalents are generating historically low returns. So you put your money in equity.

(And if you are a retiree you put it in stocks with dividends. Look at the growth in dividend-generating stocks like energy, mining and metals and it makes FANG look shitty. This is fixed income portfolios trying to achieve their needed goals.)

Ironically, it’s GDP growth that will stop the music, because enough of that will generate inflation and make it rational to hold something besides US treasuries. In fact it’s already starting to happen for non-US markets (although slower than all the hedge fund smarties thought, therefore the complete bath they’ve taken the last year).

The length of our equities boom is inversely correlated with GDP growth. This cycle is (much) longer than the historical average simply because real growth has been so low. Normalize against aggregate growth over a cycle and we have a year or two left in the current one (assuming job, GDP, wages etc continue to be anemic - if they pick up rapidly things will rapidly shift).

Re: Just own the damn robots

#239

Post by heavenlyblue »

aorloff wrote: post #170
knodi123 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The people who built those automated industries expended capital, and likely, borrowed against future revenue to do so. > What you are free to do is compete with them. You can drive them into their stupid lender's hands by forcing a collapsing of margins in the industry using your wits. So the solution for the hordes of people who were put out of work by automation, is to gamble it all on the bet that they can outc…

I'm not suggesting that literally, I'm saying that's what the overall system does. Someone will gamble their time on beating powerful established businesses, and they will figure out some efficiency to win by. Some of the factory workers will find other work, some in other industries, or other businesses in the same industry. But when you are suggesting policy, you think about the overall system, not just the poor fa…

You're saying "someone will gamble", another one would say "he was at the right time at the right place to have it all together in order to be able to take that risk. By the way - the only reason he was at the right time and at the right place was because the country he was living in could allow him to have it all".

Our planet as of today becomes an increasingly finite resource. Someone else's gamble is hedged by your responsibility.

Re: Just own the damn robots

#240

Post by aluhut »

explainplease wrote: post #222
PhasmaFelis wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's depressing how many people aren't interested in understanding how and why communism failed, and what we can learn from that. The conclusion is always just "capitalism and communism are the only two systems that exist; communism didn't work; therefore capitalism is the best and only way to run things."

I think it's helpful to look at it in terms of control vs. freedom. Communism means more state control of people, capitalism means less. In these terms, what if capitalism is simply the natural outcome of x amount of freedom? Therefore, shifting away from capitalism means shifting toward either anarchy or communism (even if both of those options are far away in absolute distances). This makes it hard to discuss thing…

As someone who comes from a soviet block country, I wanted to thank you. You described it pretty good on the meta level. I may come back and copy it in future ;)

It's far more then the mysterious criticism above deserved as an answer and the "criticism" of this comment goes the same way. There is a certain fear in left Utopism from the realization of what you've described. That fear is being drowned in endless derivations of what already failed in hope to cloud the meta problem.

To me, it's a wasted effort. This energy all those bright young people invest there could be directed towards coming up with something really new or at least making what we have more social. I hope they'll get there one day.

Post reply on HN