New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior • Hacker News Board

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#201

Post by true_tuna » Sun, Oct 15, 2017, 7:32 PM UTC

swampthinker wrote: post #14

nowarninglabel wrote: post #4

Eh, only 6% less using mass transit if you read the ITS report: • Ride-hailing attracts Americans away from bus services (a 6% reduction) and light rail services (a 3% reduction) Given that cities have had populations on the rise, this is actually good because it helps the overloaded transit systems in many places. Of course, perhaps it prevent more investment in them as well. They also noted more people may take com…

"Only" 3% of the MBTA annual ridership is still 5 million + rides.

Trains and busses in my area are standing room only for six hours a day. taking some load off those systems so they can preserve what quality of service they have left is beneficial as far as I'm concerned. Using Lyft line when possible helps alleviate congestion too.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#202

Post by coldtea » Sun, Oct 15, 2017, 7:32 PM UTC

toomuchtodo wrote: post #175

bluedino wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> because they don't want to deal with parking or drive drunk. That's what my friends use it for. It's a shame, because in the smaller midwestern towns, we don't really have Uber yet so it can't be used. Drunk driving here isn't even given a second thought.

Most bars have the names of taxi services to call if you're over the limit. To still drive because that's inconvenient is quite literally criminal.

In those towns there aren't enough taxies for everyone out -- if they exist at all.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#203

Post by GigabyteCoin » Sun, Oct 15, 2017, 7:34 PM UTC

The class of people that can pay $40 for an uber ride home right to their door is entirely different from the class of people who would wait 15 minutes out in the elements to pay $2 for a ride that would take them within a 10 minute walk of their home.

I don't really consider myself an uber or a bus person... I drive myself around most of the time and just choose not to drink too much when I am out.

But I have never shared an uber with anybody who I regularly take public transit with.

And i have never shared a public transit ride with anybody who I regularly share an uber ride home with.

All I am getting at is I do not believe that Uber is stealing away too many people from the bus system at least where I reside.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#204

Post by ringaroundthetx » Sun, Oct 15, 2017, 7:34 PM UTC

c3534l wrote: post #196

abalone wrote: post #107

tl;dr People use ridesharing mostly to go out to eat and drink (62% of trips). Riders are actually more likely to own cars. They don't want to drive when they're going out because they don't want to deal with parking or drive drunk. They don't ride the bus because it's too slow, unreliable or unavailable. If ridesharing didn't exist, two fifths of the time they'd walk, bike or use public transit instead, and a fifth…

The one fifth of trips that wouldn't exist seems like a positive to society in that it is providing a service that is actively making a difference the choices people are making, providing them with value and choice. Additionally, restaurants are happy because they're getting more customers and selling more drinks. The reduction in drunk driving is also good. I'm not sure that justifies the rest of the traffic increas…

if you imagine that they'll transition to all electric self driving cars, it would only be a net benefit right?

the transactions are still happening, in increasing volume, and the environment won't be more adversely affected

just because there might be congestion isn't a negative

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#205

Post by bartc » Sun, Oct 15, 2017, 7:35 PM UTC

ibejoeb wrote: post #174

abalone wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It may increase the "total miles traveled" but doesn't it also increase occupancy density in the cars If it did then it wouldn't increase total VMT. Again there are "deadhead" miles in those cars without any passengers at all, a fifth of those trips wouldn't have happened in the first place, and two fifths would have used alternatives that don't contribute to VMT. (According to the study.)

The fifth of those trips that don't happen sounds bad to me. Does this mean that, for example, people are not going to get groceries because they can't carry all of that on a bicycle or a bus? From the article, "Ride-hailing users have higher personal vehicle ownership rates than those who use “transit only”: 52% versus 46%." This point seems like a non-point. First, that's not a very big gap. Also, Do richer people…

Probably more like people wouldn’t go out to a cross-town bar or restaurant if they couldn’t take a taxi or lyft/uber to get there. For example, if mass transit is prohibitive (two buses at 1 am) and they don’t want to drive drunk.

Easy access to quick transportation is a general economic benefit for everyone. That’s not support for uber or lyft specifically, but if people can easily get around town, they’re more likely to make extra trips to bars, restaurants, shows, etc. where they may have otherwise considered just staying home.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#206

Post by banned1 » Sun, Oct 15, 2017, 7:35 PM UTC

snowmaker wrote: post #197

banned1 wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately many of these crimes will go unsolved because BART refuses to release videos. Apparently, releasing the videos “could lead to stereotypes” https://www.google.com/amp/sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2017/07...

BART doesn't release the videos to the public. They do release them to the police. There are legitimate reasons not to release them to the public, including the fact that the media will sensationalize them to make BART look far more dangerous than the statistics actually reflect.

Replace [BART] with Police and [police] with [congress]:

"The Police doesn't release the videos to the public. They do release them to Congress. There are legitimate reasons not to release them to the public, including the fact that the media will sensationalize them to make the Police look far more dangerous than the statistics actually reflect."

Would you still want videos withheld from the public?

After all, BART is a public agency. We are not babies who need to be protected by The Master Director because we are "the lowly citizen." That's not how it works in America.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#207

Post by jblow » Sun, Oct 15, 2017, 7:36 PM UTC

romanovcode wrote: post #118

holydude wrote: post #74

Sorry i get less sick when i commute by car hence i refuse to spend time with other people using buses/trams/subway.

Maybe you should stop touching your face often and wash your hands properly.

It is my pet peeve that people believe this.

If this were actually true, why wouldn’t we have evolved an extreme aversion to touching our faces?

Also, have you ever seen a baby? What does a baby do if you leave it alone to crawl around?

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#208

Post by abalone » Sun, Oct 15, 2017, 7:36 PM UTC

ibejoeb wrote: post #174

abalone wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It may increase the "total miles traveled" but doesn't it also increase occupancy density in the cars If it did then it wouldn't increase total VMT. Again there are "deadhead" miles in those cars without any passengers at all, a fifth of those trips wouldn't have happened in the first place, and two fifths would have used alternatives that don't contribute to VMT. (According to the study.)

The fifth of those trips that don't happen sounds bad to me. Does this mean that, for example, people are not going to get groceries because they can't carry all of that on a bicycle or a bus? From the article, "Ride-hailing users have higher personal vehicle ownership rates than those who use “transit only”: 52% versus 46%." This point seems like a non-point. First, that's not a very big gap. Also, Do richer people…

> Does this mean that, for example, people are not going to get groceries

Unlikely. Most trips are to bars, parties and restaurants.

The point about car ownership is really just refuting the belief that ridesharing leads to an immediate decrease in car ownership. Overall the study tries to focus on VMT as the more important metric, since you could sell your car and switch to ridesharing and still end up with greater VMT.

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#209

Post by yardie » Sun, Oct 15, 2017, 7:36 PM UTC

sliverstorm wrote: post #160

yardie wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mass transit is already subsidized and yet they are unable to make it work. Only one is subsidizing to gain ridership. As I’ve told friends and family it’s still cheaper than owning a car. If that equation changes I’ll re-evaluate our habits.

What do you mean "unable to make it work". Why should buses/train/subway have to be profitable? Roads for your car sure aren't. Every dollar we subsidize public transit, is far more than a dollar saved on road repair & upgrades. Just think of buses. Two to three axles. If all the riders took cars instead, that's one hundred axles. Road wear is a function of weight, for which axles is a proxy, and obviously one hundre…

I'm referring to the US as this is specifically a US problem. Our best system New York's MTA has frequent outages. While the trains are new the tracks and switches are decaying at an incredible rate.

My current city, Miami, the city is looking at reducing mass transit service [0]. After already approving a 1-cent tax to expand service MDTA reneged and used the increase to pay for existing issues (fair enough, it needed fixing). Now, we're all paying slight more for a still terrible system.

At this point I think the solution just may have to come from the open market, obviously the govt run entity is unable/unwilling to do the job.

[0] http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/a...

Re: New Research on How Ride-Hailing Impacts Travel Behavior

#210

Post by madeofpalk » Sun, Oct 15, 2017, 7:38 PM UTC

yardie wrote: post #18

I’m a big proponent of mass transit and when it’s available I use it if I can. But I can get Lyft door to door for just $1-2 more than a bus or train. If mass transit wants to keep with rideshare and livery they need to: expand routes, increase availability, update their equipment. When I was a kid I knew how to read a bus schedule and train map to plan my trip. Now, there is an entire generation of kids in school an…

This is an exceptionally US-centric study (which is fine) which all kind of centres around the atrocious state of US mass transit.

I'm sure Uber has had an impact of how people get around in other countries, but I would avoid taking this study and drawing overarching conclusions on it, like that mass transit has the same drawbacks at US does.