Earlier quoted context omitted.
That three month notice period when leaving is a hassle for employees, being a lame duck is no fun.
Better than being a broke duck.
Well, this is the case where you get a new job, so that doesn't apply.
Tesla fires hundreds from headquarters, factory
131–140 of 268 posts
Re: Tesla fires hundreds from headquarters, factory
#132The unforgivable action here is the badmouthing of the workers that they fired, gloating about increased morale. Not even Uber would sink that low.
This crap from management shouldn't be tolerated, much less celebrated.
Re: Tesla fires hundreds from headquarters, factory
#133I'm not a fan of this style of management at all. I won't knowingly go to work for a company that behaves in this manner. I've read that Netflix does it, and I've seen inferences that they acquired the practice from Disney. If you have a low performing employee that you want to get rid of, fine. Arbitrarily destroying the lives of a percentage of your workforce in an annual purge is not OK. People always seem to put…
Firing a person should not destroy their life. Something else is really wrong if this is the case.
Sure, because everyone has enough money in the bank, no running expenses, no health issues, and a new job just around the corner.
Re: Tesla fires hundreds from headquarters, factory
#134Earlier quoted context omitted.
> People always seem to put Musk on a pedestal. Personally, I've always been (and always will be) leery of a company run by a PayPal founder. Bingo! I never quite got the Musk hype train, between how he treats his employees, doesn't respect work life balance, has unrealistic expectations and talks about people not wanting to work for him as less talented, promotes the idea of American exceptionalism etc., I don't see…
He risked everything to make a rocket company from nothing, if ever there was a person that earned the hype, this is the person.
Really? Everything? His life? His children’s lives? Or just money? Or just his investor’s money?
My point being if you have a lot you can risk a lot in absolute terms, but maybe not so in terms relative to your own wealth or well-being.
I don’t think he even risked his reputation with his space rocket thing. ‘Fail fast, etc’, right?
Re: Tesla fires hundreds from headquarters, factory
#135Earlier quoted context omitted.
The problem is that a true company-wide firing of bottom 2% of performers is impossible - you would have to somehow compare and rank people with vastly different roles to pull it off. So the way to do it is to first choose unlucky departments and set a quota for each department, then choose unlucky managers and let those managers choose unlucky employees. Which makes it a lot more similar to a layoff than the company…
I know something similar often happens in the public service. Public service managers quickly learn to always hire a few useless people who they don't really need, just in case they need to make cutbacks.
Hiring people becomes a no-lose gamble: if they're good, great; if less good, solves a problem at year-end.
Re: Tesla fires hundreds from headquarters, factory
#136I used to be of the opinion that a company should have full right to drop dead weight as and when it chooses fit. The thing we forget is we, citizens, pay extortionate taxes to run a government which provides favourable incentives for companies to form and provide employment. They should, in return, be obliged to demonstrate some level of mutual benefit to employees, rather than purely incentivising shareholders' and…
So companies should follow the law? I think you're really arguing for better employee protection in the USA ?
I interpreted the post as meaning when a company is given millions of dollars in tax breaks, i.e., build your new factory here and your income tax is abated for X years, then they should be on the hook for when they let go of employees.
In theory I agree and the company should be on the hook to provide training or assistance.
Re: Tesla fires hundreds from headquarters, factory
#137Earlier quoted context omitted.
And it is exactly this style of management that is causing problems at the German automation plant he aquired (see my comment in the duplicate thread). It is probably a reason why production of the Model 3 is behind -- the company he acquired builds the factory robots needed for advanced automation. Smart move to acquire it then and it explains why the timing is now off. You can't run a German plant like an American…
Presumably one bit of Tesla culture they can't bring to Germany is firing low performers. I worked for a German company for over a decade. I don't know if it was due to their culture or their laws, but I never saw anyone get fired for poor performance (except for failing the initial 6-month probation after joining). And it's not like we didn't have low performers — once I got into management it became quite clear tha…
I've worked for companies where it was easy to fire people. There was no shortage of borderline useless people and getting fired was usually more about getting on management's nerves rather than performance.
People living in fear of their jobs created the most toxic environments.
Re: Tesla fires hundreds from headquarters, factory
#138Do other companies do this? Unless this is GE-style force ranking, I've never heard of it. If somebody isn't performing well, I have no idea why I'd wait up to a year to deal with it. And it seems terrible for morale (and PR) to have a regular event where a bunch of people will be let go in one block.
most large IT company do, including amazon google and ibm
Google doesn't do this.
Re: Tesla fires hundreds from headquarters, factory
#139Earlier quoted context omitted.
> [Musk] also joked to employees they would be going through “production hell” to meet demand for the new car. It sounds like taking sick days, vacation days, and going home at 5pm is exactly what Musk doesn't want from employees. Germans are fortunate to have those benefits guaranteed by law (and culture).
This is not for Germany only. The majority of EU contries have similar benefits guaranteed by the law.
I always wondered why laws are needed to require benefits. Seems like working for someone is a consensual choice that ought be regulated by the free market itself. Other than physical safety regulations, seems like the rest of it is government overreach. It’s also weird to me that a “contract” covers “workers” rather than a contact negotiated by each worker. Seems rather Marxist to me to consider workers as interchangeable cogs in the production machine. Some guy might not care about 30 days vacation but might prefer more money, as an example.
Re: Tesla fires hundreds from headquarters, factory
#140Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Tesla said the performance-based departures were not considered layoffs and not subject to state notifications. It also said the moves have generally boosted worker morale, as high-performing employees have been rewarded. Maybe I'm just paranoid but this part kind of smells to me.
If your employer who apparently fires people randomly asked you in a survey if you are happy about your company, would you answer honestly?
Haha, well, that's true, but I mostly meant that it looks like they might be being disingenuous about the real reasons for the firing so that they can sidestep the law about notification before a layoff. Especially when you consider that during any layoff they're probably dumping lower performers anyway.