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The privilege of risk

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Re: The privilege of risk

#21

Post by colemannugent »

frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #11
dvt wrote: post #7

Risk becomes a vehicle by which privilege reinforces itself – only the privileged can take risks and only risk is rewarded. This is patently untrue. My parents emigrated to the States in 1997 (from the post-Communist Romania) with two briefcases, two kids, and $2,000 -- hardly privileged. After their Visas expired, we technically had illegal immigrant status (after a few thousand dollars in lawyer fees and many years…

>Obviously, I don't have the same kind of opportunities as a rich trust-fund kid from Manhattan. But I'll be damned if I don't try. I recently quit my cozy six-figure job in ad-tech to try and bring some of my ideas to fruition. Will I fail? The odds are stacked against me -- I've failed before and failing sucks. The purpose of life is not wallowing in self-pity, but rising above the adversity. I leave you with this…

The GP's point was that without taking that risk their family would not be there. The opportunities he has now are the result of the risk his family took while they were underprivileged.

The GP is not a "the definition of a rich trust-fund kid", he is the definition of a self-made American.

Arguing that no one can overcome adversity with hard work is just as irresponsible as saying that everyone can overcome adversity with hard work.

Re: The privilege of risk

#22

Post by evolve2017 »

dvt wrote: post #7

Risk becomes a vehicle by which privilege reinforces itself – only the privileged can take risks and only risk is rewarded. This is patently untrue. My parents emigrated to the States in 1997 (from the post-Communist Romania) with two briefcases, two kids, and $2,000 -- hardly privileged. After their Visas expired, we technically had illegal immigrant status (after a few thousand dollars in lawyer fees and many years…

Your parents' story is very impressive, but I think it highlights some aspects of privilege I have also encountered:

- The people who are able to emigrate from a poor/devastated country are generally the educated and former middle class

- Airfare is expensive, and in real terms was more expensive in the past; two tickets across the Atlantic probably represent more than most humans will ever make in their lives

- Some people are being rounded up/denied the right to enter the country on their visas. Even having the chance to roll the dice on life in the US is a huge advantage

I could go on.

I think it's uncomfortable to think of ourselves as anything but eminently worthy/self-reliant but this doesn't hold up to close scrutiny. I say this as the child of immigrants who now are worth millions but used to work security, after arriving with $100 in their pockets.

Re: The privilege of risk

#23

Post by dvt »

evolve2017 wrote: post #22
dvt wrote: post #7

Risk becomes a vehicle by which privilege reinforces itself – only the privileged can take risks and only risk is rewarded. This is patently untrue. My parents emigrated to the States in 1997 (from the post-Communist Romania) with two briefcases, two kids, and $2,000 -- hardly privileged. After their Visas expired, we technically had illegal immigrant status (after a few thousand dollars in lawyer fees and many years…

Your parents' story is very impressive, but I think it highlights some aspects of privilege I have also encountered: - The people who are able to emigrate from a poor/devastated country are generally the educated and former middle class - Airfare is expensive, and in real terms was more expensive in the past; two tickets across the Atlantic probably represent more than most humans will ever make in their lives - Some…

You're right in the sense that we're all privileged in comparison to, say, rural Kenyans. But that's not what the original article was arguing. I feel that you're attacking a straw man here.

Re: The privilege of risk

#24

Post by true_religion »

dvt wrote: post #20
frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Obviously, I don't have the same kind of opportunities as a rich trust-fund kid from Manhattan. But I'll be damned if I don't try. I recently quit my cozy six-figure job in ad-tech to try and bring some of my ideas to fruition. Will I fail? The odds are stacked against me -- I've failed before and failing sucks. The purpose of life is not wallowing in self-pity, but rising above the adversity. I leave you with this…

> But your parents have $1M house, and you have a six figure job. Are you not the definition of a rich trust-fund kid? (To be fair, I don't know your age) No. And here's why: I grew up dirt poor. I never was able to attend computer club chess club, or what have you. My parents, when I was in high school, were constantly working (often under the table and at odd hours). They could also never afford to give me any mone…

My...700,000 for a house will you look at these poor people?

I'm a child of immigrants as well but I won't pretend that my parents did anything more than live up to the expectations bred into them during to their social class. Class Privilege is a good thing, one that we should be so lucky to give our children.

Re: The privilege of risk

#25

Post by SubiculumCode »

dvt wrote: post #17
SubiculumCode wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The quoted rule would have been better stated in terms of frequency, like: Risk becomes a vehicle by which privilege reinforces itself – for the most part, only the privileged can take risks, and for the most part, only risk is rewarded. There is substantial evidence in support of this thesis, from decades of research in economic mobility. Your story of success is only a single data point in answering this question.

> Your story of success is only a single data point in answering this question. You are, of course, right. My story is meant to inspire and serve as counterbalance to the fatalist viewpoint in the original post.

Indeed. I came from a neighborhood of dirt and chicken coops. Now I am a post-doc conducting state of the art research in cognitive neuroscience. While the money hasn't come, I suppose I have my own sort of story of upward mobility.

Re: The privilege of risk

#26

Post by jstewartmobile »

dvt wrote: post #7

Risk becomes a vehicle by which privilege reinforces itself – only the privileged can take risks and only risk is rewarded. This is patently untrue. My parents emigrated to the States in 1997 (from the post-Communist Romania) with two briefcases, two kids, and $2,000 -- hardly privileged. After their Visas expired, we technically had illegal immigrant status (after a few thousand dollars in lawyer fees and many years…

Money isn't the only form privilege takes. What about the privilege of genetics? And your folks sound pretty badass, so what about the privilege of a sound upbringing?

Re: The privilege of risk

#27

Post by hkmurakami »

>deification of risk

This is the crux of the problem, and the sooner we can get away from this, the better off we will be.

Risk is fine. Take it if it makes sense for you. But don't glorify it and don't worship it.

Re: The privilege of risk

#28

Post by Tycho »

We need people to take risks with their personal wealth. When the risk pays off, there is generally a benefit for the rest of society. When the venture fails, the rest of society is generally unaffected. When no-one takes risks, progress stagnates.

Re: The privilege of risk

#29

Post by hndamien »

colemannugent wrote: post #12
oconnor663 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was about to say the same, but on a second reading the language is really extreme: > only the privileged can take risks I guess that could be true if we take a position like "everyone is privileged to some degree", but that's not really what anyone means when they say "the privileged", and it would make the whole line meaningless anyway.

This is what I was disagreeing with. People are allowed to take risks who are not part of "the privileged", else we wouldn't have terms like "self-made millionaire".

It comes down to a multiplier effect. If you have no privilege, your multiplier is 0 or inconsequentially small as a risk multiplier for the amount of risk you can feasibly take.

Re: The privilege of risk

#30

Post by dvt »

hkmurakami wrote: post #27

>deification of risk This is the crux of the problem, and the sooner we can get away from this, the better off we will be. Risk is fine. Take it if it makes sense for you. But don't glorify it and don't worship it.

Why not? Courage (the motivator of risk) has been a virtue since the dawn of humanity.
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