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The Depression Thing

zachholman.com

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Re: The Depression Thing

#151

Post by Karawebnetwork »

Mz wrote: post #20

Some of the best ways to deal with depression: 1) Address any known health issues you have. 2) Dietary changes. There are studies on this. 3) Problem solve. If you are depressed because of terrible personal issues, work on resolving them. (The article mentions that a run won't pay his bill or fix other problems. Overwhelming problems are a legitimate cause of depression.) 4) If you are suicidal, seek company. If you…

That's the thing with clinical depression. You can be doing all the rights things and still be depressed. The worst moment of my live have been during periods where I was at my fittest and healthiest.

You think to yourself :

"I am hitting the gym three time a week. I've not eaten any junk food in months. I meditate and sleep full nights.

Why is everything still seen through a haze?

What am I doing wrong if everything should be fine? Am I broken? Who would want to speak to me. I am a fraud. I look healthy but I'm a husk of my former self. Everything is so exhausting."

I have no answer as to how to deal with it. All I can say is that cookie cutter answers rarely apply and can even make someone miserable.

Re: The Depression Thing

#152

Post by bionoid »

jlg23 wrote: post #47
ElatedOwl wrote: post #15

I was diagnosed with "major depression" when I was 14, did the medication and therapy thing for a bit but the medication made me a zombie. Therapy helped me learn to cope a little better, but I was never "cured" of my depression. My 20s have been pretty bad, but in the last year and a half I've lost 100+lbs and have been running and lifting. It turns out the common sense advice to depression was really what I needed…

Careful with that advice. It might have been good for you, it might be good for a lot of depressive people, but definitely not for all. Before I turned twenty I met two people my age who took your advice and exercised until ambulances had to pick them up (literally). Whatever you do to counter your depression, have a trustworthy, knowledgeable aid at your side: a therapist.

> Careful with that advice. [...] Whatever you do to counter your depression, have a trustworthy, knowledgeable aid at your side: a therapist.

Quoting the UiA, "One [1988] study indicates that 70% of therapists had seen for treatment at least one patient who had had sex with a previous therapist. Of the latter, 96% were male." [1]

I guess the moral of my comment is - be careful giving advice (period)

1: http://encyclopedia.uia.org/en/problem/143464

Re: The Depression Thing

#153

Post by jlg23 »

ClassyJacket wrote: post #144
jlg23 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Careful with that advice. It might have been good for you, it might be good for a lot of depressive people, but definitely not for all. Before I turned twenty I met two people my age who took your advice and exercised until ambulances had to pick them up (literally). Whatever you do to counter your depression, have a trustworthy, knowledgeable aid at your side: a therapist.

This is the most ridiculous and irrelevant warning I can imagine. Almost nobody us at risk of over exercising if they haven't started yet. It's like saying "Don't eat salad, I know someone that ate so much lettuce they got sick."

I fail to see the connection between ~"don't see exercising as a golden bullet against depression" and what you claim I've said.

Re: The Depression Thing

#154

Post by blakes »

gt_ wrote: post #80

Psychologists are much better trained than therapists. If at all possible, see a psychologist. Therapists are minimally trained, and do not understand neurological conditions on nearly the same level. If your issues are beyond basic depression, a therapist will not be able to tell.

I'm probably biased (my wife is a therapist), but I disagree with you.

Therapists require a lot of training (depends on state/specialization). Thousands of hours of supervision and a Masters degree in the field. I would not say that is minimally trained. Less so than a psychologist however.

Therapists are trained in understanding systems and the why/how something is. You are very much right about psychologists understanding neurological conditions far better than a therapist. Therapists with a bachelor degree in psychology (like my wife) mostly agree that it is useless for a lot of therapy.

Depression is a tough one. I'd just see both a therapist and a psychologist. Probably go for a therapist first and try to get some understanding of what is going on. It may help a lot! Or maybe not at all, with the nature of depression. Then see a psychologist and get some medication.

Re: The Depression Thing

#155

Post by xnm »

ElatedOwl wrote: post #15

I was diagnosed with "major depression" when I was 14, did the medication and therapy thing for a bit but the medication made me a zombie. Therapy helped me learn to cope a little better, but I was never "cured" of my depression. My 20s have been pretty bad, but in the last year and a half I've lost 100+lbs and have been running and lifting. It turns out the common sense advice to depression was really what I needed…

One of the symptoms of major depression is psychomotor retardation which causes people great difficulty in performing even simple tasks, like brushing one's teeth, doing the laundry, or showering. Advocating exercise as a cure for a disorder marked by the inability to exercise seems short sighted.

"I can't get out of bed" "You should exercise" Ugh...

Re: The Depression Thing

#156

Post by jansho »

ada1981 wrote: post #17
ElatedOwl wrote: post #15

I was diagnosed with "major depression" when I was 14, did the medication and therapy thing for a bit but the medication made me a zombie. Therapy helped me learn to cope a little better, but I was never "cured" of my depression. My 20s have been pretty bad, but in the last year and a half I've lost 100+lbs and have been running and lifting. It turns out the common sense advice to depression was really what I needed…

Have you tried regular voulentering, Gratitude letter writing, Holotropic breathwork or psychedelic therapy? I found those to be the most useful.

Volunteering is good. If you find that you focus attention on yourself too much, try shifting it to others. But keep the activities simple (manual and repetitive, like soup kitchen stuff.)

It’s also a good excuse to get out of the house, do minimum socialising and just observing the world around you. No expectations like performance measures and salaries either - your job is to just give a little.

Re: The Depression Thing

#157

Post by Mz »

Karawebnetwork wrote: post #151
Mz wrote: post #20

Some of the best ways to deal with depression: 1) Address any known health issues you have. 2) Dietary changes. There are studies on this. 3) Problem solve. If you are depressed because of terrible personal issues, work on resolving them. (The article mentions that a run won't pay his bill or fix other problems. Overwhelming problems are a legitimate cause of depression.) 4) If you are suicidal, seek company. If you…

That's the thing with clinical depression. You can be doing all the rights things and still be depressed. The worst moment of my live have been during periods where I was at my fittest and healthiest. You think to yourself : "I am hitting the gym three time a week. I've not eaten any junk food in months. I meditate and sleep full nights. Why is everything still seen through a haze? What am I doing wrong if everything…

I am not suggesting this guarantees results, and I also absolutely did not say that physical fitness approaches alone are some magic cure all. These are the best answers I know of that actually get results for some people, some of the time.

I rarely suffer depression, but I have a genetic disorder and other serious personal problems (such as: I just got off the street after 5.66 years on it and I was molested and raped as a child). My medical condition sometimes causes me to become suddenly suicidal. My two adult sons, ages 30 and 27, make sure I am not left alone when I am suddenly suicidal. They know other things to do, but a big thing is we just do not let me be alone when I am at my worst.

Getting healthier has reduced the frequency and severity of my bouts. Figuring out how to make money online so I can be functional in spite of my genetic disorder empowered me to get off the street. I am still quite poor in terms of overall income, but I have some pieces in place for my life that are usually reserved for only the very privileged. It is having a positive effect on my mood and mindset.

I am still stressing about money and I still have days when I get nothing done, but my life is vastly better than it has ever been. I am 52.

So, I am speaking from firsthand experience, in some sense. I don't suffer depression per se, but I do wrestle a lot with frequently being suicidal. It often comes on suddenly. It always involves whackadoodle brain chemistry, a side effect of whackadoodle body chemistry. I try to put out useful information to the best of my ability. I do my best to couch it in nonjudgmental, non-blamey terms.

Re: The Depression Thing

#158

Post by fiachamp »

Thanks for posting this, right around Worldwide Mental Health Awareness Day too.

To anyone reading this who is struggling but hasn't had the time to talk to a human therapist, I'm working on an accessible AI therapist to provide at least some experimentally verified help. I've got a prototype up at facebook.com/mindfulmarsha and would love feedback from yall. I work on this bot at night after work and am a ways out from doing anything to monetize it, so if you're interested in helping with dev time, message Marsha on FB or contribute to our patreon: www.patreon.com/mindfulmarsha

I was diagnosed with Generalized Anxiety Disorder after a panic attack in 2014, ironically during a time that it looked like the startup I was at was going to be unable to raise a round and my girlfriend at the time was suffering from severe depression. It has taken me years to be functional despite my appearances, and I literally, while working on adding the PHQ-9 Depression screener to the bot, realized that I had also been suffering from depression. Trying to turn this pain into a platform though. Looking forward to feedback!

Re: The Depression Thing

#159

Post by dpc59 »

pure_ambition wrote: post #84

People: PLEASE STOP recommending depressed people to take psychedelics. There is no such thing as "psychedelic therapy." Psychedelics can easily make people with mental health issues MUCH WORSE. Nobody needs a full blown existential crisis on top of major depression. I get it if you like the idea of doing psychedelics, but they are mind-altering in significant and poorly understood ways, and can easily cause others h…

There's overwhelming scientific scientific evidence that supports the potential of psychedelic therapy. Enough for the various governments to give the Multidisciplinary association for psychedelic research the legal right to study scheduled psychedelic compounds like ayahuasca, lsd, mdma and psilocybin.

http://www.maps.org/research

Re: The Depression Thing

#160

Post by thevardanian »

pgeorgi wrote: post #99
thevardanian wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're treating psychological problem like pathological ones. Mental health is not a pathological problem necessarily, but rather an physiological responsive one. As such giving medications as to "treat mental health" is the wrong perspective, and more proper perspective would one were certain physiological responses to certain environmental conditions are deemed as negative. As such to an extent the physiological res…

Therapy can work entirely without medication. There's a difference between psychologists and psychiatrists, and the article even spells it out.

Therapy works on the physiological aspects of the human by influencing the environment. Again it's not pathological.
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