I don't understand why is this called Firefox Send. Shouldn't it be called Mozilla Send?
Test Pilot experiments are by the Firefox team. They're usually more embedded in the browser, is all.
Firefox Send: Private, Encrypted File Sharing
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Re: Firefox Send: Private, Encrypted File Sharing
#72It really is a shame that there still isn't a easy way (A person whose computer knowledge extends to using facebook), that I know of, of sending arbitrarily large files that isn't tethered to a specific cloud service and is also reliable (can tolerate connection dropping). It seems that bitorrent protocols are pretty close, but I don't think there is a seamless client that allows for "magical" point to point transact…
Both parties would have to be online for any p2p solution to work. And if they are online, there are plenty of ways to create a p2p link. It is complicated by things like NAT though. However, that is the less common case. In most cases, the receiver isn't going to be online. So you need an intermediate server, and that's how you end up with third party solutions.
Yeah, the "being online" detail seems like the problem. It would be best if the encrypted data were distributed (something like IPFS) but then why would peers host files that aren't for them.
Re: Firefox Send: Private, Encrypted File Sharing
#73Earlier quoted context omitted.
When thinking about a Mozilla offering, it is healthy to think beyond "money and product" as this type of analysis will usually leave you with a conclusion of "this doesn't make business sense". Mozilla is in the game of keeping the internet healthy. Part of it involves products, such as Firefox and its quest to recover userbase. Parts of it involves money, such as MOSS awarding grants or prizes for FOSS stuff they u…
Not sure how true that is anymore. They seem to by trying hard to squander their reputation. First their MITI officially signaled they now consider themselves a political force, then the whole Cliqz debacle following shortly after showed their willingness to sacrifice their principles.
What's MITI stand for here?
Re: Firefox Send: Private, Encrypted File Sharing
#74I'm curious -- Mozilla says it can't decrypt the file on their side: Mozilla does not have the ability to access the content of your encrypted file [...] https://testpilot.firefox.com/experiments/send How is the receiver able to decrypt the file -- i.e. what is the decryption key if not the URL slug, which presumably Mozilla has as well?
The key is the hash, which isn't sent over the wire when loading a page. Now granted it's accessible via location.hash in the client, but one has to trust Mozilla not to do that.
> one has to trust Mozilla not to do that.
Exactly. One has to trust Mozilla every time one visits the page. They could easily configure it to be malicious one time out of a million (say); what are the odds that they would be caught?
Web-page-based crypto is fundamentally insecure, and Mozilla is committing an extremely grave error in encouraging users to trust it (as they also do with their Firefox Accounts). Security is important, and snake-oil solutions are worse than worthless.
Re: Firefox Send: Private, Encrypted File Sharing
#75This has been out for a while. I use it occasionally, but a single download is a narrow use case.
For many users, a single download is the most common case.
Re: Firefox Send: Private, Encrypted File Sharing
#76Earlier quoted context omitted.
WebRTC solves all the issues you're mentioning, and is available in Chrome and Firefox (in some for in Edge, and soon in Safari). Three examples of this, implemented and working: - https://www.sharedrop.io/ - https://www.justbeamit.com/ - https://file.pizza/
So, three systems which all require a central service?
What about something like Tor. You can run a hidden service to get an onion address that any Tor client can access.
Would that meet the requirements without being a "central" service?
Re: Firefox Send: Private, Encrypted File Sharing
#77They should add this as a shortcut button in Firefox. I think it makes even more sense than having the Pocket icon there. Not everyone may want to save their articles on another service, but pretty much everyone needs to send a file privately to someone else every now and then. So something like this should be super-easy to access. I learned about Firefox Send when it launched but completely forgot about it until now…
It's a Test Pilot project, so easy-to-access may be deferred until they choose to upgrade it from Test to Release, but it is certain they'll consider ease-of-use if/when they do decide to release it.
Re: Firefox Send: Private, Encrypted File Sharing
#78Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not sure how true that is anymore. They seem to by trying hard to squander their reputation. First their MITI officially signaled they now consider themselves a political force, then the whole Cliqz debacle following shortly after showed their willingness to sacrifice their principles.
What's MITI stand for here?
Mozilla Information Trust Initiative
Re: Firefox Send: Private, Encrypted File Sharing
#79Earlier quoted context omitted.
The key is the hash, which isn't sent over the wire when loading a page. Now granted it's accessible via location.hash in the client, but one has to trust Mozilla not to do that.
> one has to trust Mozilla not to do that. Exactly. One has to trust Mozilla every time one visits the page . They could easily configure it to be malicious one time out of a million (say); what are the odds that they would be caught? Web-page-based crypto is fundamentally insecure, and Mozilla is committing an extremely grave error in encouraging users to trust it (as they also do with their Firefox Accounts). Secur…
The way this gets solved in the real world is through contracts - they have a certain contract with you, and if they break it, they can get sued and lose a lot of money.
This is one of the goals of the legal system - make it so we usually trust each other. There are no real long-term technical solutions to this problem.
So if you want to make sure you're safe, read their EULA or equivalent.
Re: Firefox Send: Private, Encrypted File Sharing
#80Earlier quoted context omitted.
The key is the hash, which isn't sent over the wire when loading a page. Now granted it's accessible via location.hash in the client, but one has to trust Mozilla not to do that.
> one has to trust Mozilla not to do that. Exactly. One has to trust Mozilla every time one visits the page . They could easily configure it to be malicious one time out of a million (say); what are the odds that they would be caught? Web-page-based crypto is fundamentally insecure, and Mozilla is committing an extremely grave error in encouraging users to trust it (as they also do with their Firefox Accounts). Secur…
Send is meant to be an improvement on Dropbox & co for a specific use case.
Is it perfect? No, it isn't. But it is still a considerable improvement.
If you have a better solution in mind for the average user crowd, feel free to suggest it, of course.