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New York governor approves short-term apartment rental ban in NYC

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Re: New York governor approves short-term apartment rental ban in NYC

#121

Post by borism »

jawngee wrote: post #120
DanielBMarkham wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was going to use a bit of napkin logic to explore what you've said, but on further inspection your logic is circular, so needs no further exploration. If these things should be regulated because they are of a type of thing to be regulated? Then we haven't really advanced the discussion much, have we? Maybe you want to have a "big government" argument, but forget all of that. I'll assume you are correct. This is a t…

What other enterprises similar to AirBnB that aren't regulated? Restaurants? Regulated. Car rental? Regulated. Retail? Regulated. Banking? Regulated. Hotels? Regulated. Bed and Breakfasts? Regulated in the state of New York. Bars? Regulated. Movie Theaters? Regulated. Name me one thing that isn't regulated, subject to zoning, subject to inspection, subject to fire and/or safety codes? It isn't a matter of big governm…

I agree with most of what you said, but why is random rotation of people is bad for other tenants.

Also, isn't this a part of what New York is? I'd love to live in this city for a month or two or what is possible on a visa, but this will make such dream impossible.

Re: New York governor approves short-term apartment rental ban in NYC

#122

Post by earl »

jgoewert wrote: post #50
earl wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or people who live in the most dense housing in the US deciding they don't want randoms, particularly people from out of the city who often aren't aware of just how loud they are, frequently moving in and out as neighbors. As a former and future resident of NYC and current resident of SF, I'd hate to live next to such a place. I did until recently in SF and it sucked.

> randoms, particularly people from out of the city who often aren't aware of just how loud they are Doesn't stop anyone from in-town either. I lived for a year in a place that the upstairs neighbor stomped everywhere as he was morbidly obese and had to use the toilet frequently. The neighbor on the right played rap and hip-hop at max blast from midnight til 6 am, often leaving it on all day when he left to work. And…

Neighbors two blocks away are simply nothing like neighbors 2 inches of pressboard and a couple two-by-fours away.

As for permanent neighbors, call the board or your landlord. Either should happily fix that problem for you.

Re: New York governor approves short-term apartment rental ban in NYC

#123

Post by petercooper »

fmora wrote: post #117
petercooper wrote: post #71

Meanwhile, there are people of privilege or wealth who are renting places for $500 a month next to Central Park. What a world.

Source?

It's a known problem, but..

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Theres+nothing+liberal+about+r...

http://www.nber.org/~luttmer/rentcontrol.pdf

Search http://www.streetsblog.org/2010/02/10/nycs-rent-stabilized-p... for "rent control"

Re: New York governor approves short-term apartment rental ban in NYC

#124

Post by earl »

borism wrote: post #121
jawngee wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What other enterprises similar to AirBnB that aren't regulated? Restaurants? Regulated. Car rental? Regulated. Retail? Regulated. Banking? Regulated. Hotels? Regulated. Bed and Breakfasts? Regulated in the state of New York. Bars? Regulated. Movie Theaters? Regulated. Name me one thing that isn't regulated, subject to zoning, subject to inspection, subject to fire and/or safety codes? It isn't a matter of big governm…

I agree with most of what you said, but why is random rotation of people is bad for other tenants. Also, isn't this a part of what New York is? I'd love to live in this city for a month or two or what is possible on a visa, but this will make such dream impossible.

For the fifth time on HN: Manhattan is the most dense housing in the US. The vast majority of Americans and most visitors to the states don't live in anything comparable. Further, unless you live in a prewar, lots of housing in Manhattan is pretty inexpensively built -- especially anything dating from the 60s and 70s, of which there is a lot. Little concern was paid to sound insulation, and often the walls between neighboring apartments are no thicker than the walls between rooms. Thus, people are much more circumspect about the noise they make and their behavior in order to live and get along in such housing.

Further, long term tenants know they will have to see and get along with each other so there are further incentives to not being noisy or obnoxious.

On the other hand, short term tenants often want to party and have no such incentives not to be shitty neighbors. This isn't merely theory but also my experience living next to a short term place in SF. Thus, many denizens of NYC and SF do not want such neighbors.

Re: New York governor approves short-term apartment rental ban in NYC

#125

Post by earl »

mikecane wrote: post #102

I don't know how many of you here are native NYers. And I stress the native, because anyone who hasn't lived here for decades won't have a deep understanding of how things work here. Going out to the Hamptons (or elsewhere) for two weeks or a month and renting out your place has been going on here for decades. This has never been something hidden from the government, The Village Voice would be filled with Short-Term…

Pretending that something that went on mostly via word of mouth between neighbors or at least acquaintances is comparable to a scaled business on the internet is silly.

Re: New York governor approves short-term apartment rental ban in NYC

#127

Post by richcollins »

jonknee wrote: post #97
richcollins wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you don't want to live someplace that allows short term rentals, make sure it's in the contract that you sign when you buy the place. No regulation required.

You already did, unlicensed hotels aren't legal to run out of your home. This law just makes that easier to enforce.

That isn't a contract its a law. A law that I'm arguing against in favor of contracts.

Re: New York governor approves short-term apartment rental ban in NYC

#128

Post by sprout »

w00pla wrote: post #78
sprout wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Starting with the land, water, and air of this Earth, there are many resources that no one created, and no one has the right to give you. We parcel it out, and we say that this patch belongs to me, and this patch belongs to you, but the 'fairness' of it is always imperfect. In a city, you cannot say that you have sole right to a piece of property, to do with as you please. Everything's too packed in together. If you'…

> Starting with the land, water, and air of this Earth, there are many resources that no one created, and no one has the right to give you. If we divide all the land in the world equally, within 20 years some people will have more and some people will have less (due to differing productivity and non-coercive selling). This isn't unfair - it just means that some people are unproductive. > In a city, you cannot say tha…

>This isn't unfair - it just means that some people are unproductive.

Sure, but in another 50 years many of their children will have just as much land through none of their own doing. If others could have used the land better, I'd say there's a good deal of unfairness there. It's possible life could have been better for everyone if not for inheritance.

>Blasting music is a different story - you are effecting your neighbour's quality of life (and destroying his property value).

Eh? That's the sort of thing I was talking about. You have the right to do what you want, within reason. But that said, you can't for example use residential land for a commercial enterprise beyond a certain point, and there are good reasons for these sorts of zoning laws.

On your last point, the state is the proxy by which we as a group determine how to divvy up that wealth that cannot be directly attributable to any one group. Again it is imperfect, but it's better than letting those who own the land have the entire say, because they are not necessarily responsible for the value in that land.

Re: New York governor approves short-term apartment rental ban in NYC

#129

Post by mikecane »

fmora wrote: post #118
mikecane wrote: post #102

I don't know how many of you here are native NYers. And I stress the native, because anyone who hasn't lived here for decades won't have a deep understanding of how things work here. Going out to the Hamptons (or elsewhere) for two weeks or a month and renting out your place has been going on here for decades. This has never been something hidden from the government, The Village Voice would be filled with Short-Term…

I'm a native. Never heard of this. We must be on different economic classes. I come from a working class and so does everybody I grew up with.

Did you never have to look for an apartment in The Village Voice?

Re: New York governor approves short-term apartment rental ban in NYC

#130

Post by mikecane »

earl wrote: post #125
mikecane wrote: post #102

I don't know how many of you here are native NYers. And I stress the native, because anyone who hasn't lived here for decades won't have a deep understanding of how things work here. Going out to the Hamptons (or elsewhere) for two weeks or a month and renting out your place has been going on here for decades. This has never been something hidden from the government, The Village Voice would be filled with Short-Term…

Pretending that something that went on mostly via word of mouth between neighbors or at least acquaintances is comparable to a scaled business on the internet is silly.

It was never word of mouth. Newspapers would have entire sections of Short-Term Rentals and Sublets. Patterson just killed all that advertising -- like newspapers needed more income lost! [typo edit x3]
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