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Practical tips for writing inclusive job ads (2016)

blog.hostedgraphite.com

11–20 of 68 posts

Re: Practical tips for writing inclusive job ads (2016)

#11

> No ninjas, rockstars or brogrammers, please; just nice, caring humans. I like how in a post about inclusive job ads, they still wanted to show off that they Exclude The Right People . Their cultural based discrimination is obviously correct and should be applied universally; previous cultural based discrimination is a crime we should all strive to avoid! I actually enjoyed the post (and agree with most of the point…

i think you might be conflating the discouragement of a behavior with the application of an identity to people, something the article seems to try to avoid.

hostedgraphite isn't saying they don't want competent programmers, even if they've copped the brogrammer attitude in the past, but rather, to leave the brogrammer stance at the door. if you can't do that, then (and only then) don't apply for the job because you probably won't fit in (and likely as a result, won't be as successful).

we wear different faces at different times (shout out to billy joel!), and can discard one (or put it in the back pocket) as desired/needed.

Re: Practical tips for writing inclusive job ads (2016)

#12
post #8

I would replace " No ninjas, rockstars or brogrammers, please; just nice, caring humans." with "Just nice, caring humans". "no..." sentences sound defensive to me.

I've heard ninja is just the new term for full stack developer, though.

Re: Practical tips for writing inclusive job ads (2016)

#13
Can someone define what a "rockstar programmer" is and why a company would want to not hire rockstar programmers?

Here's one definition I found: http://www.urbandictionary.com/author.php?author=ChrisTTT

A computer programmer with such strong skills and so much specific experience that they are the equivalent of a rock star in the domain of software. Many people play guitar pretty well, but only a few become rock stars. These programmers can develop more software than 5 - 10 newly hired regular programmers because they know what needs to be done and how to do it. They also might set the architecture of the product that dozens will build upon.

What's wrong with that?

Re: Practical tips for writing inclusive job ads (2016)

#14
"Evidence That Gendered Wording in Job Advertisements Exists and Sustains Gender Inequality"[1] looks at wording of job applications effect on applicant pool. I know there are some start-ups[2] in this area trying to automate the process the author describes.

[1] http://gender-decoder.katmatfield.com/static/documents/Gauch...

[2] https://textio.com/

Re: Practical tips for writing inclusive job ads (2016)

#16

> No ninjas, rockstars or brogrammers, please; just nice, caring humans. I like how in a post about inclusive job ads, they still wanted to show off that they Exclude The Right People . Their cultural based discrimination is obviously correct and should be applied universally; previous cultural based discrimination is a crime we should all strive to avoid! I actually enjoyed the post (and agree with most of the point…

i think you might be conflating the discouragement of a behavior with the application of an identity to people, something the article seems to try to avoid. hostedgraphite isn't saying they don't want competent programmers, even if they've copped the brogrammer attitude in the past, but rather, to leave the brogrammer stance at the door. if you can't do that, then (and only then) don't apply for the job because you p…

I understand that their message is "this is not a frat". However, I still absolutely hate the pejorative usage of brogrammer. People do not use it to exclusively refer to culture.

It is absolutely a label that is applied to people. Sitting here, I feel like I am part of the specter of brogrammers that looms over the industry. Whether it was their intended usage or not, I feel like this term is referring to programmers like me.

Their job ad is not going to have the context of this blog post. Their job ad doesn't say "no brogrammers, but we don't mean men who work out and code, we actually mean the toxic culture of exclusivity that you would see in a frat." Nope, their job ad just says "no brogrammers". If I saw that I would assume that their culture would be toxic toward me.

Please stop using this term. There are people out there who feel like it applies to them and it alienates us. I agree with OP, it is not a term that encourages inclusivity because there is a stereotypical image of a person that comes to mind when it is used.

Re: Practical tips for writing inclusive job ads (2016)

#17
I'll add one - I immediately ignore any job ad that contains anything along the lines of "Work in an exciting/agile fast-paced, dynamic environment", which pretty much signals that only youngsters need apply.

Of course, if the job really is chaotic and high-stress, then that signal should probably stay in the job ad.

Re: Practical tips for writing inclusive job ads (2016)

#18

I'll add one - I immediately ignore any job ad that contains anything along the lines of "Work in an exciting/agile fast-paced, dynamic environment", which pretty much signals that only youngsters need apply. Of course, if the job really is chaotic and high-stress, then that signal should probably stay in the job ad.

"Work in an exciting/agile fast-paced, dynamic environment",

Or they're just randomly cut-and-pasting whatever fast-sounding lingo they've seen in other ads.

Either way, it's a negative tell.

Re: Practical tips for writing inclusive job ads (2016)

#19

Can someone define what a "rockstar programmer" is and why a company would want to not hire rockstar programmers? Here's one definition I found: http://www.urbandictionary.com/author.php?author=ChrisTTT A computer programmer with such strong skills and so much specific experience that they are the equivalent of a rock star in the domain of software. Many people play guitar pretty well, but only a few become rock star…

I'll tackle this.

- If they are expected to do 5-10 times the amount of software development as a regular new programmer, are they going to be offered 5-10 times the regular salary?

- Are all the other programmers at the company dramatically more effective than a regular programmer? Most competent people don't think of themselves as being exceptionally better than their peers, so if that's the case, they probably shouldn't bother.

- Or, are the other programmers at the company just regular ones, and the incoming new person is expected to be more effective than all of them combined from day one? That's a lot of pressure to put on one person. What was the answer to the salary question again?

- Many people who have developed exceptional skills in one area have neglected other areas. What types of personal problems is the company willing to tolerate for the privilege of hiring rock stars? Is alcoholism okay? How about being sexually creepy towards co-workers, due to lack of social skill practice? How about body odor? Not that all exceptionally skilled programmers have these types of problems, but you have to make a trade off somewhere. Really, how much are you paying them? Because someone who is 5 or 10 times more productive than a normal programmer without being a socially impossible weirdo is likely already in a job paying far more than what hr had in mind for this position.

Is there no place for a programmer who's just basically competent and professional and will work for an average salary? Do you want to drive those programmers away?

Re: Practical tips for writing inclusive job ads (2016)

#20
post #8

I would replace " No ninjas, rockstars or brogrammers, please; just nice, caring humans." with "Just nice, caring humans". "no..." sentences sound defensive to me.

You could say:

We value the ability to work with others over exceptional technical skills. That is, while there is value in the latter, we value the former more.

No "no", no defensiveness, but the preference is clear.

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