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The web at maximum FPS: How WebRender gets rid of jank

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Re: The web at maximum FPS: How WebRender gets rid of jank

#91

Post by throwaway613834 »

deafcalculus wrote: post #82
pohl wrote: post #13

Now that this is closer to shipping, I'm curious what impact this would have on battery life. On the one hand, this is lighting up more silicon; on the other hand: a faster race to sleep, perhaps? Have there been any measurements on what the end result is on a typical modern laptop?

Games eat a lot of power by rendering this way. So, definitely a concern, and I'd want to see benchmarks before switching from Safari on my macbook. That said, GPUs are pretty clever about this. A big chunk of power consumption comes from IO. i.e., moving data from the GPU to the off-chip DRAM. Mobile GPUs optimize for static scenes where nothing is changing by keeping hashes of small blocks (say 32x32 pixels) of the…

By mobile GPU do you mean like Intel? Or even NVIDIA?

Re: The web at maximum FPS: How WebRender gets rid of jank

#92

Post by deafcalculus »

throwaway613834 wrote: post #91
deafcalculus wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Games eat a lot of power by rendering this way. So, definitely a concern, and I'd want to see benchmarks before switching from Safari on my macbook. That said, GPUs are pretty clever about this. A big chunk of power consumption comes from IO. i.e., moving data from the GPU to the off-chip DRAM. Mobile GPUs optimize for static scenes where nothing is changing by keeping hashes of small blocks (say 32x32 pixels) of the…

By mobile GPU do you mean like Intel? Or even NVIDIA?

Mali. Not sure about the others.

Re: The web at maximum FPS: How WebRender gets rid of jank

#93

Post by namibj »

throwaway613834 wrote: post #91
deafcalculus wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Games eat a lot of power by rendering this way. So, definitely a concern, and I'd want to see benchmarks before switching from Safari on my macbook. That said, GPUs are pretty clever about this. A big chunk of power consumption comes from IO. i.e., moving data from the GPU to the off-chip DRAM. Mobile GPUs optimize for static scenes where nothing is changing by keeping hashes of small blocks (say 32x32 pixels) of the…

By mobile GPU do you mean like Intel? Or even NVIDIA?

I think he means Mali and such.

Re: The web at maximum FPS: How WebRender gets rid of jank

#94

Post by htn369 »

pimeys wrote: post #87
JepZ wrote: post #80

While I would consider myself more a Golang fan than a Rust fan, I am impressed by the speed by which the Mozilla team is changing fundamental parts of their browser and somehow I believe rust has something to do with that speed.

I've been working professionally with Rust for a year now. When I got over the first wall, it has become the best tool I've had for creating backend applications. I have history with at least nine different languages during my professional career, but nothing comes close giving the confidence and ergonomics than the tools Rust ecosystem provides. Firefox, especially the new Quantum version is awesome. But Rust as a s…

How complete is the Rust library and complementing open source projects comparing with golang?

Re: The web at maximum FPS: How WebRender gets rid of jank

#95

Post by drudru11 »

pohl wrote: post #13

Now that this is closer to shipping, I'm curious what impact this would have on battery life. On the one hand, this is lighting up more silicon; on the other hand: a faster race to sleep, perhaps? Have there been any measurements on what the end result is on a typical modern laptop?

I have some experience with immediate mode UIs.

These UIs and Game engines typically burn CPU and GPU even for an idle menu on the screen.

I suspect that Mozilla will only re-render and composite on actual changes. Otherwise the power draw will be quite noticeable. The benefit of this new arch will be that they can guarantee 60 fps during that time.

Re: The web at maximum FPS: How WebRender gets rid of jank

#96

Post by pacaro »

AceJohnny2 wrote: post #79
pacaro wrote: post #60

Humourously enough, when I worked on a team that was writing a graphical web browser for mobile in the late 90's [1], they used a display list for rendering. The reasoning was somewhat different, web pages were essentially static (we didn't do "DHTML"), if the page rendering process could generate an efficient display list, then the page source could be discarded, and only the display list needed to be held in memory…

Opera?

The company was STNC Ltd. The µbrowser was called Hitchhiker. STNC was acquired by Microsoft in July 99.

My understanding is that the demo at GSM World in 98 was the first time anyone had demonstrated a graphical browser on a cellphone that implemented common web standards (HTML/HTTP/TCP) rather than using a transcoding gateway (up.link or WAP style — the approach taken by Unwired Planet)

The smallest device that we targeted (IIRC) had a screen that was 100x64 pixels, we had 64KiB of RAM at runtime (`unsigned char gHeap[0x10000];`), and our ROM footprint was about 350KiB

Re: The web at maximum FPS: How WebRender gets rid of jank

#97

Post by mncharity »

kadal wrote: post #71

Re: HW Acceleration Is this going to work at all on Linux?

On Ubuntu 16.4 LTS, I just now installed rust nightly[1], and pathfinder[2], and the three demos appear to work in the default firefox 56, but not in chromium 61.0.3163.100[3]. Disk usage was half GB, split between ~/.cargo and pathfinder/ . Time was... less than a snack. My GPU was integrated Intel HD 520. I already had npm 3.10.3.

[1] https://www.rust-lang.org/en-US/install.html Select 2, for custom install, and change to "nightly". My host triple was x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu. [2] https://github.com/pcwalton/pathfinder [3] TextDemoView.initContext (view.ts:324) Uncaught (in promise) TypeError: Cannot read property 'createQueryEXT' of null .

EDIT: The three demos are: some text; the SVG tiger; some planar text in 3-space.

Re: The web at maximum FPS: How WebRender gets rid of jank

#98

Post by pimeys »

htn369 wrote: post #94
pimeys wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been working professionally with Rust for a year now. When I got over the first wall, it has become the best tool I've had for creating backend applications. I have history with at least nine different languages during my professional career, but nothing comes close giving the confidence and ergonomics than the tools Rust ecosystem provides. Firefox, especially the new Quantum version is awesome. But Rust as a s…

How complete is the Rust library and complementing open source projects comparing with golang?

Probably not that complete, but getting better. I needed to write some of my own libraries, but for http server/client hyper[0] is fast and quite comfortable. It's getting a http2 support soon[1] and the ecosystem around the tokio[2] framework grows fast.

I need to do fast consuming and for Kafka the situation is quite good, for rabbitmq I have stuff that works but I needed to hack with a knife to get stuff working the way I wanted.

Everything's quite low level in the end and there hasn't been a task I couldn't solve either by myself or finding a library and doing a couple of pull requests to get things running. The hardest was to implement a working HTTP-ECE for web push notifications by reading and understanding all the RFC drafts, but the project[3] teached me a lot. Basically all my consumers deal with millions of events every hour, using 0.1 cpu's and about 50 megabytes of RAM. Uptimes reaching 2-3 months if I don't need to update the software.

[0] https://github.com/hyperium/hyper

[1] https://github.com/carllerche/h2

[2] https://tokio.rs/

[3] https://github.com/pimeys/rust-web-push

Re: The web at maximum FPS: How WebRender gets rid of jank

#100

Post by the_duke »

kkarp wrote: post #90
spiderfarmer wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here. FF has always performed poorly on my 15” 2015 rMBP, but this made it worse.

I suggest reporting a bug to Bugzilla. The positive side effect will be you will see how efficiently they handle such reports. And you will get it fixed.

I'm pretty sure they are aware of it.

I have the same issues on Linux. It's really fast, but often it hogs one core completely and the CPU does a lot of work, sending the fans in overdrive. Especially when videos are involved.

Let's hope things get ironed until a stable release in november

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