Java at Alibaba [pdf] • Hacker News Board

Re: Java at Alibaba [pdf]

#41

Post by ram_sankar83 » Tue, Oct 10, 2017, 8:44 AM UTC

ninjakeyboard wrote: post #28

Java is well suited to very large projects only because developers are "commodity." With the modern language updates, the core java collections library is really broken for modern multi-paradigm programming. There are no true immutable collections in the core lib which makes Java really show its age with the newer language features compared to other more modern languages such as scala. Functions are bolted on as "Sin…

Inferences: Java developers are dumb, commodity. Scala/Haskell devs are smart and get things done in 100x speed. Conclusion: Ignore this comment

Re: Java at Alibaba [pdf]

#42

Post by sreque » Tue, Oct 10, 2017, 1:58 PM UTC

_old_dude_ wrote: post #15

There was a presentation with more info at last JVM Language Summit https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4tmr3nhZRg The scary things is that they have implemented coroutine (generalized async/await) by copying the stack back and forth instead of putting the stack in the heap like in stackless python or in scheme.

It's also far far slower performance-wise to put it on the heap. GoLang also does stack-copying with their continuations, and it's probably the best implementation strategy we have right now.

There were a number of interesting projects at Da Vinci, including full TCO. I wonder how much further along Java would be if more of those projects got merged into mainline.

Re: Java at Alibaba [pdf]

#43

Post by ninjakeyboard » Tue, Oct 10, 2017, 8:46 PM UTC

knightofmars wrote: post #29

ninjakeyboard wrote: post #28

Java is well suited to very large projects only because developers are "commodity." With the modern language updates, the core java collections library is really broken for modern multi-paradigm programming. There are no true immutable collections in the core lib which makes Java really show its age with the newer language features compared to other more modern languages such as scala. Functions are bolted on as "Sin…

In a "not big enterprise" environment, what would you choose instead?

I'm a scala engineer. I also work with elixir a bit but Scala is preferred.

Re: Java at Alibaba [pdf]

#44

Post by ninjakeyboard » Wed, Oct 11, 2017, 4:44 PM UTC

ram_sankar83 wrote: post #41

ninjakeyboard wrote: post #28

Java is well suited to very large projects only because developers are "commodity." With the modern language updates, the core java collections library is really broken for modern multi-paradigm programming. There are no true immutable collections in the core lib which makes Java really show its age with the newer language features compared to other more modern languages such as scala. Functions are bolted on as "Sin…

Inferences: Java developers are dumb, commodity. Scala/Haskell devs are smart and get things done in 100x speed. Conclusion: Ignore this comment

Commodity doesn't mean dumb. There is a general set of skills that most java developers have, and there are a lot of people that have them. So you can replace a developer with another one fairly easily. It's much harder to do with scala. And much harder with elixir or haskell.