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Dear Silicon Valley: America’s fallen out of love with you

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Re: Dear Silicon Valley: America’s fallen out of love with you

#301

Post by s73ver_ »

0xcde4c3db wrote: post #55
gotthemwmds wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" there is no a priori reason for women and ethnic minorities to be less prevalent in our high-paying fields." Sure there is: racist and sexist white males making decisions and developing a workplace culture that prevents them from attaining those positions. And the sooner people accept this, the better for everyone.

> racist and sexist white males making decisions and developing a workplace culture One need not be white or male to be biased against people of color or women. It's probably easier for us to fall into those patterns, and historical patterns of deliberate oppression were undoubtedly a major factor in establishing those biases as dominant cultural patterns, but anyone can do it with a little extra effort to rationaliz…

No, they don't. However, it would be rather silly to not acknowledge that the majority of people making these decisions are white and male.

Re: Dear Silicon Valley: America’s fallen out of love with you

#302

Post by CalChris »

Clubber wrote: post #292
CalChris wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a huge difference between being elite (we are and I sure am) and elitism . In fact the author stabs at the heart of Silicon Valley elitism: Your ideas are only as good as the people in the room. And your door is shut to most people.

I don't think I've ever heard someone call themselves elite outside of a gaming session. You should probably use the numbers 1337 though. Wouldn't calling yourself elite, seemingly unaware of what that projects to people count as elitism?

If Michael Jordan calls himself elite, is he an elitist? If a quite successful Valley engineer calls himself elite, am I an elitist? These are different words. Populists will call SV elitist. That doesn't make them right.

Re: Dear Silicon Valley: America’s fallen out of love with you

#303

Post by unhinged_wanker »

api wrote: post #116
nsxwolf wrote: post #105

Middle America is not too keen on your "basic income" solution to all the problems you are creating. It brings to mind a future of living in a 300 square foot government apartment in some hideous Brutalist concrete block of a building, eating our daily Amazon rations, knowing that's just how life is going to be, forever, no need to have dreams anymore. There will be torches and pitchforks coming for you.

It reminds me of the endless ghettoes of William Gibson's Sprawl trilogy (Neuromancer, etc.) where people are basically warehoused and left to jack into "simstim" and rot. In reality the pitchforks will come out as you say and this endless ghetto will be paired with a total surveillance police state to contain the angry aimless masses. Perhaps not coincidentally this is exactly what Silicon Valley seems to be buildin…

god what conservative bullshit. you must labor for others or else you are useless! just, no.

>There's this idea that if you give everyone basic income they'll all turn into philosophers and artists and entrepreneurs, but it's not true

No one says that you disingenuous weasel. Basic income is so that people can survive without being forced to hold a job. This is especially important for those that cannot hold a job - children, elderly, sick, disabled - or those that have lost jobs through automation, where there IS no more job to have.

> "put people to work"

Most people already work (95%+) and those that don't - children, elderly, sick, disabled - those people aren't ever joining your work programs. They make up a huge percentage of the total population and you just.. ignore them like they don't count. But i guess in your eyes 'work or starve' is better so there are no 'moral' issues, right?

Re: Dear Silicon Valley: America’s fallen out of love with you

#304

Post by Chathamization »

matt_wulfeck wrote: post #227
dna_polymerase wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea behind BI is that you can still work, but if you don't work you still get to live. If you want more than the concrete block - fine. Go do something and earn money, but if not just STFU and live with what you get.

You realize that with our current entitlement programs that if you don’t work you still “get to live” right? There’s all sorts of safety nets, and many normal people use them.

> There’s all sorts of safety nets, and many normal people use them.

Yeah, and they're often a mess. You often have to sign up in a bunch of different places and deal with a bunch of different broken bureaucracies, which isn't the ideal thing to have dropped on your plate when financial hardship strikes. It's not surprising that, for example, "Only about 1 in 6 people who are eligible for child care subsidies actually get it."[1] Simplifying the system and having it already active when people hit a hardship would be a huge improvement.

I was reading a story about one cities dilapidated homeless shelter. The people there were living in poor conditions - the building's infrastructure was falling apart, the food provided was terrible, etc. It was costing the city $4,680 a month to house the people there. The people would be much better off if the city simply handed them that money - heck, they'd be much better off if the city simply handed them half of that.

[1] http://www.npr.org/2016/08/21/490822086/the-financial-trials...

Re: Dear Silicon Valley: America’s fallen out of love with you

#305

Post by Caveman_Coder »

julianozen wrote: post #36

To you, in the words of one Silicon Valley investor, this seems like “the only logical conclusion.” To the average person, this seems like the height of arrogance. People are uncomfortable with universal basic income because you’re essentially saying their labor isn’t worth anything — but you don’t see it! I think this point is really missing from most UBI conversations that happen on HN. UBI is the answer when you b…

> "I would be interested in seeing startups trying to solve suburban problems and producing suburban jobs."

In my opinion these aren't technical problems to be solved by a team of engineers in their SF Bay offices. They are political problems that need legislative solutions. To think that we can outsource political problems to the realm of tech is misguided and won't solve our long-standing public policy issues.

Re: Dear Silicon Valley: America’s fallen out of love with you

#306

Post by richardwhiuk »

aylmao wrote: post #239
matt_wulfeck wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or a $3/hour jobs becomes a $1 an hour job because markets are incredibly efficient at pricing in a new, free flow of money.

Exactly, which is why even with UBI we need reasonable minimum wages.

Why? Minimum wage is largely designed to stop people being exploited by a form of economic slavery, but the UBI should prevent that, and mean that the wage has to be attractive.

Re: Dear Silicon Valley: America’s fallen out of love with you

#307

Post by richardwhiuk »

nsxwolf wrote: post #105

Middle America is not too keen on your "basic income" solution to all the problems you are creating. It brings to mind a future of living in a 300 square foot government apartment in some hideous Brutalist concrete block of a building, eating our daily Amazon rations, knowing that's just how life is going to be, forever, no need to have dreams anymore. There will be torches and pitchforks coming for you.

It's difficult to imagine a more off-topic comment. If you are choosing basic income as a poster child of Silicon Valley, you need to be much clearer about that.

Re: Dear Silicon Valley: America’s fallen out of love with you

#308

Post by aylmao »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #280
aylmao wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It lets the person whose labor is only worth $3/hour take a $3/hour job and still not starve to death. You'd still know that your labor is worth only $3/hour, and if you're not starving to death it's because you're on this safety net. How is this feeling "you're serving a purpose" and that "there's value in what you do" as per my parent comment? Again, a job is about much more than the money, and "not starving to d…

> You'd still know that your labor is worth only $3/hour, and if you're not starving to death it's because you're on this safety net. But your labor is worth only $3/hour. The only way to change that is for the person to improve their skillset, but if that was practical in a given case then it would happen regardless.

Value is not intrinsic to the object, but varies depending on the market and its rules. Go to another country and your labour might be worth more or less.

So your labor is not worth $3/hour, it's worth $3/hour in this market. The approach I think would be better for everyone is designing the market so that your labor holds some value.

Re: Dear Silicon Valley: America’s fallen out of love with you

#309

Post by jeffdavis »

southphillyman wrote: post #300
Klockan wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cultural appropriation of Mexican small shops. Note that I don't really see the issue, the name describes their business well.

Bodegas traditionally are run by Puerto Ricans and Dominicians in the NE (Not Mexicans). Taken into a NY-centric context it's easier to understand the backlash in a rapidly gentrifying and appropriating atmosphere.

I still don't get it. Cultural appropriation is everywhere, and the inevitable and obvious result of cultural mixing. What makes this different?

Maybe it has more to do with economic competition than cultural sensitivities?

Re: Dear Silicon Valley: America’s fallen out of love with you

#310

Post by s73ver_ »

staticelf wrote: post #56

As a non-american and as a person who has never been to SV but love the idea that is described in the article that anyone can start up a company I would like to adress the points in the article. 1. Your ideas are only as good as the people in the room. And your door is shut to most people. Well, if anyone can start a company the door isn't shut. I don't buy that white men only invests in white men. I think people inv…

"Well, if anyone can start a company the door isn't shut. I don't buy that white men only invests in white men. I think people invest in companies (for the most part) where investors think they will gain the most money from."

Numbers don't lie. And there are countless examples of times where women-led startups couldn't even get meetings with VCs, but after adding a male founder, suddenly were asked to come in for meetings.

"I think countries of the world should make it easier and less expensive to start a company. That is the best recipee for success in my view. If it is less of a risk to create a company, more people will do it."

Most of the costs are not something that countries can help with. You're still going to need funds for equipment, salaries, and such.

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