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Zucktown, USA

thebaffler.com

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Re: Zucktown, USA

#141

Post by Spivak »

jschwartzi wrote: post #136
Spivak wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is basically saying that when you lose your job they stop paying you.

And that COBRA is not as free as people make it sound. In fact it's more expensive. I pay $3.00/month for the group policy at work, but when I get fired I will also lose the company's payments to the plan on my behalf. So my expenses actually go up as a result of trying to take advantage of COBRA. Whereas if I were paying for my own policy, I would be aware of what it costs and would be paying the same price for insu…

You can also just ask your employer what their portion of the benefits is while you're employed. They'll be more than happy to tell you.

Re: Zucktown, USA

#142

Post by horsecaptin »

greedo wrote: post #101
Spooky23 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Circumstances change quickly. I'm married, things happened, and we ended up having a baby. Due to various circumstances beyond our control. That cost $100k. As a healthy guy in my 20's, I suffered an injury through no fault of my own that led to me needing a serious back surgery. Net cost -> $250k. Rolling the dice on something that fundamentally life altering, and expecting society to pick up the tab for the consequ…

So you had a baby due to circumstances beyond your control? And you had an injury, again through no fault of your own? And the sum of those are over $350K. Who is responsible for your health? I'd argue that the baby is entirely on you, and $100K for a delivery is insane unless you had incredible complications. And if the back injury wasn't your fault, you could seek redress from whom is responsible. If it's work rela…

The problem with litigation is that it takes forever. And while things are processing, you'll still be on the hook. If for example, you're the victim of a hit-and-run and the offender can't be found, you're still on the hook.

When this happens, the vultures will be circling. And this happens far too often.

Re: Zucktown, USA

#143

Post by p49k »

greedo wrote: post #101
Spooky23 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Circumstances change quickly. I'm married, things happened, and we ended up having a baby. Due to various circumstances beyond our control. That cost $100k. As a healthy guy in my 20's, I suffered an injury through no fault of my own that led to me needing a serious back surgery. Net cost -> $250k. Rolling the dice on something that fundamentally life altering, and expecting society to pick up the tab for the consequ…

So you had a baby due to circumstances beyond your control? And you had an injury, again through no fault of your own? And the sum of those are over $350K. Who is responsible for your health? I'd argue that the baby is entirely on you, and $100K for a delivery is insane unless you had incredible complications. And if the back injury wasn't your fault, you could seek redress from whom is responsible. If it's work rela…

Sometimes no one is at fault for an accident. Accidents aren’t always caused by negligence on someone’s part.

Re: Zucktown, USA

#144

Post by greedo »

horsecaptin wrote: post #142
greedo wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you had a baby due to circumstances beyond your control? And you had an injury, again through no fault of your own? And the sum of those are over $350K. Who is responsible for your health? I'd argue that the baby is entirely on you, and $100K for a delivery is insane unless you had incredible complications. And if the back injury wasn't your fault, you could seek redress from whom is responsible. If it's work rela…

The problem with litigation is that it takes forever. And while things are processing, you'll still be on the hook. If for example, you're the victim of a hit-and-run and the offender can't be found, you're still on the hook. When this happens, the vultures will be circling. And this happens far too often.

I agree, there are lots of catastrophic events that can occur randomly. That's the ideal situation for real insurance (as opposed to what we have now). But statistically, most people use insurance for what amounts to either routine care, or care after they've neglected their health. And in the case of the poster I was replying to, he is basically giving up his agency and expecting society to make him whole.

Re: Zucktown, USA

#145

Post by notyourday »

humanrebar wrote: post #118
notyourday wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They don't make sense for knowledge workers. Knowledge workers are rarely interchangeable, so standardizing contracts, job titles, pay schedules, working conditions, etc., makes little sense. There is also the chance for protectionism (closed shops) that runs counter to the freelance culture in tech. If that was the case, no one would have been whining about H1B import companies killing US knowledge jobs.

I think your conclusion is premised on a false dichotomy: that either tech jobs are standardized or H1B visas are harmless. There are many ways both can be false at the same time.

Oh no, jobs are not standardized. They workers doing those jobs are interchangeable.

Re: Zucktown, USA

#146

Post by heedlessly2 »

eru wrote: post #116
heedlessly2 wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

but realistically, you'll be hanging out less often and you'll fade into feeling like an outsider?

Sure. Same thing as quitting a hobby you spend considerable time with and made lots of friends in. I moved internationally so often, I'm used to building new circles of friends.

a hobby you can always pick up again whenever.

Harder to comeback to a job and much more awkward to hangout around old coworkers.

Re: Zucktown, USA

#147

Post by eru »

metaphorm wrote: post #127
pault wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For some people liberty means freedom from government interference; for others it means freedom from corporate and class oppression.

it's shocking that this division exists. liberty requires freedom from ANY institution, whether state, church, or corporation, from having too much power over your life.

What if you volunteer enter this arrangement? Marriage with kids being a prime example.

Re: Zucktown, USA

#148

Post by Spooky23 »

greedo wrote: post #101
Spooky23 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Circumstances change quickly. I'm married, things happened, and we ended up having a baby. Due to various circumstances beyond our control. That cost $100k. As a healthy guy in my 20's, I suffered an injury through no fault of my own that led to me needing a serious back surgery. Net cost -> $250k. Rolling the dice on something that fundamentally life altering, and expecting society to pick up the tab for the consequ…

So you had a baby due to circumstances beyond your control? And you had an injury, again through no fault of your own? And the sum of those are over $350K. Who is responsible for your health? I'd argue that the baby is entirely on you, and $100K for a delivery is insane unless you had incredible complications. And if the back injury wasn't your fault, you could seek redress from whom is responsible. If it's work rela…

My wife had a baby. We knew about that part.

What was out of control was a complication that nearly resulted in her death.

Those types of things happen. If you are married to someone who has a stroke, should you be sentenced to a lifetime of ramen noodles and destitution because your spouse needs care that costs $500/day.

Re: Zucktown, USA

#149

Post by Spooky23 »

greedo wrote: post #133
lawrenceyan wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you feel about people with debilitating genetic diseases/disorders? Through no fault of their own other than being born into this world, and no health care provider wants to anything to do with them. They are guaranteed money losers, and if insurance companies didn’t have to deal with pesky regulations, they would happily find and drop these patients. I make no judgements on your moral character, but to follow…

I have no issue with society picking up after people who truly have catastrophic illnesses (though that's really what health insurance SHOULD be, not the way it is currently.) My issue is with people expecting society to pay for health care that's not catastrophic nor "accidental." If I choose to have a child, I should expect to pay for it. My partner and I had to have IVF, and we paid for it.

You paid for the IVF.

You likely didn’t pay for the prenatal care after the first trimester, and likely didn’t pay for the delivery beyond coinsurance.

Re: Zucktown, USA

#150

Post by freeflight »

eru wrote: post #114
freeflight wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All the surplus will be eaten up by the companies. That can easily be fixed by plugging tax evasion loopholes and generally taxing higher. If there's a will then there's a way, the problem is pretty much finding the way everybody agrees on.

See https://transformationdeal.org/2016/04/24/how-a-basic-income... for a very straight forward proposal.

Nice to see something like this adapted to the US, I've seen comparable proposals in Germany [0], also build on a similar base of taxing land value/production facilities.

Imho it seems like pretty valid approach considering land is one of the few resources we recognize as actually being finite, so it's a good place to start for building a "base".

On the other hand it's quite frustrating how accepting we have become of creating "wealth" out of nothing by printing paper money but if we try to do the same thing based on something actually tangible, like land, people lose their shit going "you can't just make up money", sure we can, we do it all the time.

[0] http://www.wissensmanufaktur.net/plan-b

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