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Productive on six hours of sleep? You’re deluding yourself, expert says

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Re: Productive on six hours of sleep? You’re deluding yourself, expert says

#281

Post by skinnymuch »

fish_fan wrote: post #220
GhostVII wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hunter gatherer societies also weren't paying for cell phones, and internet, and mortgages/rent. I'm sure you could get by working part time for 15 hours a week if you gave up all of your modern conveniences and lived outdoors in a tent, but it wouldn't be very enjoyable.

> I'm sure you could get by working part time for 15 hours a week if you gave up all of your modern conveniences and lived outdoors in a tent, but it wouldn't be very enjoyable. It’s interesting you’d say that. I agree on average, but the enjoyment in that lifestyle would be hard to imagine in ours. I don’t think it’s hard to see our perception of pleasurable things is different from frequency. Frankly I think there…

Can you explain what you mean by "is different from frequency"?

Re: Productive on six hours of sleep? You’re deluding yourself, expert says

#282

Post by gebeeson »

yesimahuman wrote: post #226
nroach wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bear in mind that we segment our activity more in "modern" society. For example, in agrarian societies you didn't need to carve out time for exercise. Work was exercise. You also didn't need to carve out time for child care, because children worked alongside adults much of the time. And commuting wasn't really an issue when workplaces and residences were in the same community with minimal geographic separation. It's…

I'm also struck by cities that commute heavily by bike (such as Amsterdam). Your commute is your exercise. That is not how most Americans live, however.

I would absolutely love to commute by bike. Distance is a factor but that is not the primary issue. I am in south-east Georgia and bike lanes are an absolute foreign concept. I mean even if we had them, people would use them as passing lanes and all that. I've seen plenty of 'sleep hack' articles recently; trying to do more with less where sleep is concerned. To me that is a complete non-starter. I truly just need more sleep.

Re: Productive on six hours of sleep? You’re deluding yourself, expert says

#283

Post by gebeeson »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #276
mncharity wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, it's like trying to work in an open office, with people repeatedly stopping by with problems, and springing surprise meetings, and... well, maybe not quite that bad? :)

I'm not sure what's scarier: a coworker stopping by saying, "hey, the PROD-DB-1 server has been down for four hours" or your four year old stopping by and saying, "there's an oops in the kitchen."

If you train the four year old correctly you might even get "there's an oops on the PROD-DB-1 server". That would be more than I get from some of my adult co-workers.

Re: Productive on six hours of sleep? You’re deluding yourself, expert says

#284

Post by gebeeson »

wmil wrote: post #39
lutorm wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, studies have shown that hunter-gatherer societies spent much less than 40h/week "working" and had more leisure time than we do. It's just recent history that's an anomaly...

Not only that, but the 40h/week ignores commutes. For some people that's an additional 15h/week. Also hunger-gatherers lived right beside the people they knew. They just had to step outside to meet up with friends to socialize.

The commute has been an issue of mine for a while - and listening to podcasts or audio books helps but, I'd rather just step outside to get to work. I blame this on where I live and my absolute reluctance to move. So yeah, commuting is my choice in the end.

Re: Productive on six hours of sleep? You’re deluding yourself, expert says

#285

Post by pavel_lishin »

gebeeson wrote: post #283
pavel_lishin wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what's scarier: a coworker stopping by saying, "hey, the PROD-DB-1 server has been down for four hours" or your four year old stopping by and saying, "there's an oops in the kitchen."

If you train the four year old correctly you might even get "there's an oops on the PROD-DB-1 server". That would be more than I get from some of my adult co-workers.

A friend of mine runs a rural radio-based ISP, while raising... four? kids or so. It's entirely possible that some of his downtime was caused by someone accidentally spilling juice into something and letting the magic smoke out, but I've never asked.

Re: Productive on six hours of sleep? You’re deluding yourself, expert says

#286

Post by jacinda »

bonzini wrote: post #247
pavel_lishin wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once they got old enough, sure. Until then, women typically took care of them. Good luck working alongside an 18 month old.

Well, with 6 kids or more in each family taking care of small children was a full-time job of its own. Not to mention not having things such as a washing machine...

With 6 or more kids in each family older children frequently helped with chores and helped take care of the younger ones. Even a 5-year old is capable of helping with simple childcare tasks and a responsible 10-year old is capable of being a babysitter for periods of time.

Children would also be naturally spaced because breastfeeding around the clock typically continued until the child was at least 18 months old, meaning that they would normally be 15-30 months apart (the amount of time that breastfeeding acts a contraceptive varies widely from woman to woman but typically breastfeeding on demand will halt a woman's reproductive activity for at least 6 months).

Re: Productive on six hours of sleep? You’re deluding yourself, expert says

#287

Post by _Tev »

gcvbvghb wrote: post #254
photonios wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also used to feel this way. What worked for me is to not to do some of these things. For example, I got a robot vacuum cleaner and a robot mop. For any additional cleaning, I have a cleaning lady that comes every once in a while. This saves me a couple of hours of cleaning each month. If the car breaks, or something needs to be done around the house, I hire someone to do it. Groceries are delivered according to a s…

> Labour cost are so low here, and salaries in IT are so high Where’s this magical place?

Central / Eastern Europe.

And I heard similar things about south and east of Asia

Re: Productive on six hours of sleep? You’re deluding yourself, expert says

#288

Post by Xeoncross »

freehunter wrote: post #167
Xeoncross wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> people used to work 100 hour weeks Many people still work +100 hour weeks - just not all for their primary paying jobs. Raising children, side projects, home repair, etc..

Well if we're defining it like that, literally everything is a job so people work 24/7.

I don't think we have to get out of hand. The average American watches 2hours of TV a day (Nielson). I don't think we would say that was "a job". There are plenty of leisure and other activities one could forgo to actually "work".

Re: Productive on six hours of sleep? You’re deluding yourself, expert says

#289

Post by rhcom2 »

isostatic wrote: post #75
rhcom2 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CPAP is usually the first line for sleep apnea. I've been using one for the past couple of months. They've improved the masks so the really only annoyance is being tethered to the machine when you roll over but it isn't too bad. Another thing I've learned is the CPAP machines now phone home to the insurance company to give them compliance data on how and when you use the machine. Less happy about that.

You have a free market in healthcare, vote with your wallet.

I'd love to but the thing's base price is $800 without hoses or mask. I can't afford that without going through my insurance.

Re: Productive on six hours of sleep? You’re deluding yourself, expert says

#290

Post by QuarterReptile »

I recognize the thrust of this argument, and anecdotally agree with it from my experience,but it's not practical advice. Work 12 hours, spend at least 30 minutes each way commuting,work out, prepare and eat meals, and you're at pretty nearly 15 hours, without counting preparing for work. Sure,you have time for sleeping 8 hours,but only if you eschew any personal life and find your work sufficiently exciting to not see any need for recreation/fun all week. Dropping to about 6.5 hours of sleep at least doubles time for those things each work day.

I've tried maintaining 8 hours of sleep daily in such conditions. What I've found is that I'm productive for two days. By Tuesday or Wednesday night, I'm frustrated and bored, and spend 3 or 4 hours doing something interesting and, bam, week derailed. For me, 6.5 hours is the compromise that works. Plus, I sleep 9 hours on Friday and Saturday nights.

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