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How a ’50s-Era New York Knife Law Has Landed Thousands in Jail

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Re: How a ’50s-Era New York Knife Law Has Landed Thousands in Jail

#71

Post by twobyfour »

tomohawk wrote: post #67
KGIII wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

0.6% of the population are lawyers. 41% of legislators are lawyers. Legislators propose, write, and vote on the laws. It's duplicitous to say that lawyers don't propose, write, or vote on laws.

Lawyers should recuse themselves from being legislators. It's a conflict of interest.

So laws should be written by people who don't have any training in how their language will be interpreted or in how laws are applied?

Most legislators aren't also actively practicing lawyers and are not writing laws with the aim of giving themselves more business.

Re: How a ’50s-Era New York Knife Law Has Landed Thousands in Jail

#72

Post by LgWoodenBadger »

dangerbird2 wrote: post #37
dogma1138 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most weapon bans are pretty silly and arbitrary. Look at the old AWB... Flash hider? Banned.. Muzzle Break? ok... Bayonet Lug? Banned... Grenade launcher oh sorry I mean “flaregun attachment” is ok as long as you can’t fix a bayonet on it...

"Flash hider? Banned.. Muzzle Break? ok" In all fairness, muzzle breaks have practical civilian use as a way to reduce recoil for target shooting, while flash hiders just make it difficult for authorities to spot the location of a shooter. Muzzle breaks actually increase the noise level of a firearm, making more detectable than a stock barrel.

Flash hiders don’t hide a flash. They’re used to protect the shooter’s eyes from the flash affecting their (night) vision.

Re: How a ’50s-Era New York Knife Law Has Landed Thousands in Jail

#73

Post by refurb »

maxerickson wrote: post #64
madengr wrote: post #41

Screw all gun and knife laws. Wholly unconstitutional. In my state, I can carry a concealed gun and switchblade, no license necessary. That’s the way it should be nationally.

At least until we repeal the 2nd Amendment.

Good luck with that!

Re: How a ’50s-Era New York Knife Law Has Landed Thousands in Jail

#74

Post by RealityNow »

arca_vorago wrote: post #21

This is a single symptom of a larger issue, namely an excess of laws to the point that any law can be arbitrarily used to prosecute you if you are of an unwanted class, race, etc. Add on top the police quota system and you have a recipe of this type of injustice that runs the gamut, from antiquidated knife laws to the drug war. To me, this is largely a result of lawyers fucking ruining everything they touch, and then…

It's absolutely absurd that "arrest quotas" are even a thing in America. The job of the police in most first world countries is to protect the people, not make arrests for ludicrous laws. I don't want my tax dollars funding police officers camping out on highways to hand out speeding tickets or arresting random people for having pocket knives on them. No wonder Americans have such an adversarial relationship with the police.

Re: How a ’50s-Era New York Knife Law Has Landed Thousands in Jail

#75

Post by briantakita »

arca_vorago wrote: post #21

This is a single symptom of a larger issue, namely an excess of laws to the point that any law can be arbitrarily used to prosecute you if you are of an unwanted class, race, etc. Add on top the police quota system and you have a recipe of this type of injustice that runs the gamut, from antiquidated knife laws to the drug war. To me, this is largely a result of lawyers fucking ruining everything they touch, and then…

This is why the 2nd Amendment is an important right to uphold. If one cannot protect oneself against criminal elements, one is vulnerable to be harmed, intimidated, & suppressed.

Outlawing certain types of guns & knives also exposes the population to selective enforcement, civil asset forfeiture, & other means to tyranny.

Of course, there are practical limits, like it probably wouldn't behoove us to ensure that everybody has a right to carry a briefcase nuclear bomb.

It's about creating a cogent system of checks & balances that acknowledges that people oppress each other. A system that acknowledges that politics can be a vehicle of liberation/oppression, that the voting public can be educated/deceived, & that people unite or devolve into tribes.

Re: How a ’50s-Era New York Knife Law Has Landed Thousands in Jail

#76

Post by mcheshier »

redler wrote: post #62

"She still feels sick about the conviction she was compelled to hand out, to a man who was initially stopped by police for being in a city park after nightfall. Although the law was, in her view, deeply flawed, she felt she had no choice but to vote with the majority. Glaser herself carries a Swiss Army knife on her keychain. “It just seemed like a trumped-up charge,” she says. “And it certainly doesn’t seem like it’…

Came to post this exact same thing.

Rational potential jurors out there, don't dodge that summons! You're the last safeguard against tyranny.

Re: How a ’50s-Era New York Knife Law Has Landed Thousands in Jail

#77

Post by mcheshier »

jokoon wrote: post #61

I'm not American, but I don't understand, how did this man get those 6 years added in a tribunal? Did he go to court? I mean what kind of legal people put this guy in jail for that? I mean did anybody blink on it? Sure the law is a problem, but I don't see what motivations the justice system can have to apply the law like that, can somebody explain it to me?

It's difficult to tell from the article. Unfortunately in the USA the poor don't have the same ability to defend themselves as the rich, and it often skews along racial lines. We also have repeat offender laws that can catch up reformed criminals as well as repeat ones.

Re: How a ’50s-Era New York Knife Law Has Landed Thousands in Jail

#78

Post by Pinckney »

I think it's useful to view these laws as a way to get around the standard of "beyond a reasonable doubt."

The actual societal problem -- the one that's been illegal forever -- is robbery. But it's hard to catch robbers. If they aren't caught in the first few minutes, there's a good chance they get away for good.

When the police stop somebody and find a knife on them, they might think "this person is probably using this to stick people up." The legislature can't pass a law that says "conviction for robbery requires now requires only probable cause", but they can try to achieve the same effect by making it illegal to carry a knife.

Re: How a ’50s-Era New York Knife Law Has Landed Thousands in Jail

#79

Post by [deleted] »

jokoon wrote: post #61

I'm not American, but I don't understand, how did this man get those 6 years added in a tribunal? Did he go to court? I mean what kind of legal people put this guy in jail for that? I mean did anybody blink on it? Sure the law is a problem, but I don't see what motivations the justice system can have to apply the law like that, can somebody explain it to me?

[deleted]
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