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A “right to repair” movement tools up

economist.com

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Re: A “right to repair” movement tools up

#241

Post by CaptSpify »

amelius wrote: post #194
noam87 wrote: post #99

I've been thinking recently that there is exists a completely unxplored market in tech. Local shops based around FOSS / open hardware where designers, hardware and software people work together to build custom projects for their clients. I would call this person a "technology artisan", because the closest analogue I can think of is a tailor or a carpinter. So, for example, a family would go to their local technology…

> So, for example, a family would go to their local technology artisan to put together a smart home system tailored specifically to their needs. I'm getting a bit tired of the smart home system example. We've seen projects for smart home systems in DIY magazines since the 70s. These projects never really took off, and turned into businesses (Nest being a notable exception). It's something people don't really need or…

If people don't really want it, why do they keep paying for it? IoT products are selling like crazy.

Re: A “right to repair” movement tools up

#242

Post by chestervonwinch »

KozmoNau7 wrote: post #204
jokoon wrote: post #18

Planned obsolescence is why I will never invest more than 100 euros into a phone. I will always wait to buy low-priced, fast enough for me hardware. I still remember how my macbook pro started to be slow and unusable after OSX updates. My real wish is that one day, computer or smartphone hardware might last at least 5 or even 10 years. I know software is evolving quickly, but there comes a point where I don't think y…

My desktop is 7 years old, admittedly that is a 3.3GHz Phenom II X6 with 16GB RAM, the highest available configuration on that socket/motherboard. It's still going strong, though of course it struggles with some newer games, which isn't as relevant to me as it used to be. My laptop is a refurb T420, around 5-6 years old. Runs Linux Mint and all the apps I need with no issues at all, still gets 5+ hours on battery. Co…

My desktop is an old Optiplex 760, apparently made in 2008, and its my main "home office" computer. I bought it from a public auction web site from the local university for around $20-30. I wiped Windows XP and installed Ubuntu. I upgraded the RAM to 6 GB for next to nothing (the limit is 8, I think). I've used it for nearly 3 years for daily use, general computing, and sometimes computationally intensive, days-long numerical experiments for research. Is it a top-of-the-line machine? No, but for grad student with virtually no budget, it suffices quite nicely.

Re: A “right to repair” movement tools up

#243

Post by thomastjeffery »

thechao wrote: post #12
stefco_ wrote: post #6

I hope at some point we'll start including recycling/disassembly and replacement externalities into price somehow. I don't know how you would do that in a fair way, but it is frustrating that there aren't a ton of corrective market forces to encourage manufacturers to make highly reusable, repairable, recyclable devices. All of this electronics churn is environmentally terrible, and it's frustrating that, as with car…

I always thought that a regulation along the lines of "if you sell it, you must give the customer the ability to dispose of it" would be nice. And, yes, I do think that means Amazon would have to have some sort of bricks-and-mortar operation: at minimum there must be a shop owned by someone , which Amazon has a deal with, that you'd be able to drop your discarded Amajunk off at. Also, I also think we should have a ca…

> Also, I also think we should have a carbon recapture tax added to gasoline

That can't work for any country that has "country".

In the US, the vast majority of goods are delivered using trucks that burn diesel.

You can't have a gas tax without a diesel tax. Everyone would just switch over.

If you tax gas, you effectively tax everything, and that's not okay for any economy.

Re: A “right to repair” movement tools up

#244

Post by ThrowawayIP »

bpicolo wrote: post #237
strictnein wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is very common in the US, although there is no regulation governing it. Most places will take your old appliances away when they deliver your new ones. Heck, our power company will pay you $35 if you recycle a working fridge or freezer through them. With them coming out to pick it up for free. The idea being that a lot of people stick their old, inefficient fridge in the basement or garage when they get a new on…

I'm surprised they don't want you to pay for more electricity. Good on them

In Michigan at least, these programs are funded by the taxpayer. $Power_Company gets to make a profit on every crappy fridge they haul away or every LED lightbulb they install.

Re: A “right to repair” movement tools up

#245

Post by iicc »

pawelk wrote: post #195
stefco_ wrote: post #6

I hope at some point we'll start including recycling/disassembly and replacement externalities into price somehow. I don't know how you would do that in a fair way, but it is frustrating that there aren't a ton of corrective market forces to encourage manufacturers to make highly reusable, repairable, recyclable devices. All of this electronics churn is environmentally terrible, and it's frustrating that, as with car…

In Poland, and I believe it's an EU regulation, every seller is obligated to take your old appliances when you buy new ones in the same category. For example when you buy a freezer you can drop your old one for recycling free of charge (so the cost is included in the retail price). Sometimes it's even used in marketing ("bring your old TV, get new one 10% cheaper"), maybe because they need to meet some quotas so they…

> I believe it's an EU regulation

Yep.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waste_Electrical_and_Electroni...

Re: A “right to repair” movement tools up

#246

Post by ghaff »

icebraining wrote: post #230
wiz21c wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Completely off-topic but you sure don't want to work for free (hint: the problem with that has nothing to do with the money)

I've heard that before, but I'm not convinced. Supposedly clients treat you better if they're paying, but in my experience, the correlation doesn't hold. At least by not charging I feel freer to walk away when I'm not being respected.

Yeah. I'm not convinced either. I do little things for various small non-profits/volunteer organizations and I've basically never had anyone bug me because it took me a bit longer to get to something than I anticipated. If I'm paying someone market rates to do a task, you can be sure that I'll be doing the "when will it be done?" thing if they get behind schedule.

Re: A “right to repair” movement tools up

#247

Post by ghaff »

yourapostasy wrote: post #223
mastax wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gillette? Having started to use a safety razor recently, I'm starting to think that the impetus for moving to cartridge razors was just to make the refills harder to interchange and less of a commodity.

Along similar lines, if you get isopropyl alcohol (I use 90% grade, but 70% may also work), after using your razor, dry it off, and spray your razor with the alcohol, the alcohol displaces any remaining water and sanitizes at the same time. It makes the razor last longer. Works on electric razors, too.

Way back when, someone in school did some sort of senior project along these lines. Yeah, as I recall, most of the accumulated damage to razor blades is associated with corrosion rather than wear from cutting.

Re: A “right to repair” movement tools up

#248

Post by Filligree »

pc86 wrote: post #236
KozmoNau7 wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Warranty for 6 months, right to complain for 18 months after that. The difference is the burden of proof. For the initial 6 months, the manufacturer/store has to prove the item was not somehow defective from the beginning, due to manufacturing errors or similar mishaps, even if it broke 5 months and 29 days after the sale. In the following 18 months, the burden of proof shifts to the buyer, to prove that the fault di…

Doesn't that make sense, though? If you have a physical product that you use daily, I don't think it's entirely unreasonable to ask how a failure after 700+ uses (or many, many more) can be confirmed as a manufacturing issue and not use [over|mis|ab]use.

How can a user prove they didn't misuse an item, though?

Re: A “right to repair” movement tools up

#249

Post by dx034 »

valuearb wrote: post #78

If I want my laptop to be a lighter thinner appliance glued together in an aluminum body so tightly that it’s super tough and resistant to damage, will I still be able to have that?

In reality, most parts will still not be glued but use screws. And even if it's glued, replacing it shouldn't be an issue if the company sells the equipment?

Re: A “right to repair” movement tools up

#250

Post by dx034 »

bo1024 wrote: post #102
m3kw9 wrote: post #92

You get more bulky and expensive device for the right to repair. Would not want that.

I think you are confusing two different problems with repair (the article does not do a great job distinguishing them). 1) Difficulty to repair because of physical design, e.g. goods that are physically challenging to open and modify or require specialized tools. This is often a reasonable side-effect of making devices as small or light as possible. I.e. making it physically difficult to repair. 2) Erecting legal bar…

In addition to legal barriers, #2 can also be about specialised parts that are not documented and not sold (officially). E.g. inventing new screws just to make it harder to open a case.
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