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Three Paths in the Tech Industry: Founder, Executive, or Employee

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131–140 of 632 posts

Re: Three Paths in the Tech Industry: Founder, Executive, or Employee

#131

This is rather true in practice, but I find it tremendously depressing. I have found that the executive path is actually the one that most of the scumbags take, it is the one that attracts the most people, and those people are usually not likable, they're salespeople that sell themselves all day. The third group, the one that actually creates value, is accurately represented as not as successful both in terms of mone…

I overall agree with your sentiment. I would though not agree fully about where you assume value is created. Usually, developers / middle managers do not create value. Mostly they are implementing ideas of others and in these ideas is most of value concentrated. I would say they deliver value but don't create most of it.

Doesn't that depend on your definition of creating value? Im biased because I'm a developer perhaps, but I think that these ideas would all be theoretical concepts if these developers weren't actively building them.

Perhaps I have a pessimistic view of the industry, but I've worked at 4-5 startups now (4-5 because one I'm on the fence about calling a startup) and I've come to find that the most value was always "created" when the devs and middle management (product) worked closely together to deliver and hustled/bustled without being blocked by some upper management bullshit. As soon as these companies grew, and these 250k-300k a year "executives" joined, everything slowly went up in flames. This is anecdotal, but it's an issue I've come to notice through personal experience in our industry.

Re: Three Paths in the Tech Industry: Founder, Executive, or Employee

#132
post #51

Regardless of which path you'd like to go down, learn some basic financial planning, frugality, and learn to live like a miser. It'll pay dividends, both figuratively and literally. Regarding the executive path, or more generally any management role, learn early on if it's for you. If you're the type that gets caught up in human interest stories, considers it inhumane to fire low performers, or generally believes in…

For someone who recently graduated and quite clueless about financial planning, do you have some resources to get started?

Absolutely. Dave Ramsey's approach is probably my favorite. Basically, don't buy it if you don't have the money for it. https://www.daveramsey.com/

Re: Three Paths in the Tech Industry: Founder, Executive, or Employee

#133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I share you bullishness about "untapped" cities, but: > ...starting a company in an area that does not need the top tier of engineers... As far as quality of talent, the "top tier of engineers" aren't all in SF, Seattle, or NYC. There are plenty of "top tier" engineers in all kinds of places. If you mean the "top tier" in pay rates are in those cities, that probably true. But those cities also have a ridiculous cost…

Except Champaign has top-tier engineers

I intended for that to be my point. They're not just in SF. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

Re: Three Paths in the Tech Industry: Founder, Executive, or Employee

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> fancy apartment Being a 400 sq. ft. studio that you pay $3k per month for to live in an area where you won't get stabbed when you go out at night and is close enough to work where you don't need a car.

Why would you ever live in a studio if you want to save money?

"Studio" is American for "zero-bedroom apartment". It's an advertising-friendly euphemism, just like "garden" is American for "below ground level apartment".

An American studio apartment is essentially a hotel room with kitchenette. It has only two doors, one for the bathroom and one to the exterior. Thanks to fire codes, it will usually have at least one escapable window.

While it isn't the lowest tier of city housing, it is the smallest type of apartment with significant supply in the US. Dormitories aren't tremendously common away from university campuses, and communal barracks are uncommon outside of the older military bases--where they are generally mothballed until a particular need arises for large quantities of temporary housing.

Re: Three Paths in the Tech Industry: Founder, Executive, or Employee

#135
post #104

> Often times there are hard barriers preventing people from starting a company. In these cases my best advice is to move to a tech hub (preferably the Bay Area) and work for a tech company until you can save the money I had to laugh there. Moving to the Bay Area will reduce your ability to save money, not increase it. I was probably saving 40-50% of my salary when I worked in Nowhereville, Florida. With the housing…

Here's my counter-anecdote. I hesitate to do this but I think it's nice for aspiring software engineers to have details. I moved to San Francisco in 2006 straight out of college to work at Google as a SWE. I was $27k in debt (student loan + credit card). My rent was $1450 at the time (2 bedroom with a roommate in a nice part of town), and I took out a $26k loan to buy a car. I'm not particularly frugal. I did well at…

So 7-11 years ago. Not very relevant anymore since the cost of living has increased significantly in SF since then.

Re: Three Paths in the Tech Industry: Founder, Executive, or Employee

#136

> • Often don’t get a voice in major decisions – even when you “know the right answer” I'm not sure if the use of quotes here is intended to imply one doesn't actually know the right answer, but only feels that way. It's a particularly important point, I feel in my career I've met so many managers insecure in themselves that they would never consider listening to an idea from a report, not unless you can convince the…

I suspect "know the right answer" is "my institution is too bureaucratic to actually implement obvious right things" "managers don't listen" "I think I know what I'm talking about, but I don't see above my little serfdom and upper level decisions look weird from here" "I'm a prideful jerk with strong opinions"

Scare quotes are meant to cover 3 and 4 I think

Re: Three Paths in the Tech Industry: Founder, Executive, or Employee

#137

> Often times there are hard barriers preventing people from starting a company. In these cases my best advice is to move to a tech hub (preferably the Bay Area) and work for a tech company until you can save the money I had to laugh there. Moving to the Bay Area will reduce your ability to save money, not increase it. I was probably saving 40-50% of my salary when I worked in Nowhereville, Florida. With the housing…

40% of $45k is 12% of $150k, and that doesn't value in the experience and networking opportunities of working in the Bay Area

That's an unreasonable comparison. Where would you be working for 45k that would equate to a 150k salary in SF?

Re: Three Paths in the Tech Industry: Founder, Executive, or Employee

#138

> Often times there are hard barriers preventing people from starting a company. In these cases my best advice is to move to a tech hub (preferably the Bay Area) and work for a tech company until you can save the money I had to laugh there. Moving to the Bay Area will reduce your ability to save money, not increase it. I was probably saving 40-50% of my salary when I worked in Nowhereville, Florida. With the housing…

I keep on hearing about that.. so what's savings rate people should expect in SF?

Depends on your circumstances. If you're single, 50% or more, easily. If you're married/living with a partner or roommate, even more. If you have kids and/or significant debt, that drops significantly (my family of four saves about 10%).

Re: Three Paths in the Tech Industry: Founder, Executive, or Employee

#139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just for comparison, I lived in SF for about 4 years. I saved a huge amount of money. I lived with 3 roommates to save money, I sold my car, you won't get stabbed anywhere in SF (so live in the sketchy area it'll get nicer each year). My rent was $1,200 a month, a lucky find. Now don't get me wrong I hated living there, no girls, homelessness everywhere smelled like garbage, and a self-obsession that pretended to be…

> you won't get stabbed anywhere in SF (so live in the sketchy area it'll get nicer each year) This is flatly untrue and bad advice - there are absolutely areas of San Francisco where you run the risk of being the victim of physical violence. Some people will be comfortable living in that kind of environment but many won't, and suggesting that all of San Francisco is uniformly safe is irresponsible.

Out of curiosity, what areas would you say this to be true? Not denying there are dangerous areas, but I've only lived in SF for 2 years and haven't lived in many neighborhoods (1 year near the SoMissPo underpass and another near UCSF mission bay). The only one that comes off as dangerous at night to me would be the tenderloin or perhaps mid-market (although the latter is quickly becoming more and more expensive).

Re: Three Paths in the Tech Industry: Founder, Executive, or Employee

#140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I share you bullishness about "untapped" cities, but: > ...starting a company in an area that does not need the top tier of engineers... As far as quality of talent, the "top tier of engineers" aren't all in SF, Seattle, or NYC. There are plenty of "top tier" engineers in all kinds of places. If you mean the "top tier" in pay rates are in those cities, that probably true. But those cities also have a ridiculous cost…

It depends on what you are doing. If you are trying to build something like a database kernel, you want people who have done it before, very specialized. There aren't lots of them outside of the tech hotspots. I don't necessarily mean there aren't smart people outside of the hotspots, but there isn't the specialized skillsets that get built from working at the Microsofts / Googles etc. edit: In the number that you ne…

> There aren't lots of them outside of the tech hotspots.

Maybe. But how many people live in those places because that's where the well-paid jobs are?

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