Live data from Hacker News

Ending factory farming as soon as possible

80000hours.org

21–30 of 83 posts

Re: Ending factory farming as soon as possible

#21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> though it's possible before that we'll figure out how to combine plant products in ways that make them taste very similar to meat I think the major barrier to mass adoption of this will be convincing the masses that they should try it. Too bad it can't be marketed as meat, at least not for long before getting caught.

In principle, it's possible that plant-based meat substitutes could become cheaper than real meat, simply because raw plants are always cheaper per calorie than meat. So the question is whether the conversion from raw plant to meat substitute can be done for cheap enough.

Actually, I'm thinking of some of my, uh, close-minded relatives who would refuse to eat such a thing out of 'principle.' The only way to convince them would be to trick them for several years.

Re: Ending factory farming as soon as possible

#22
post #8

Just pointing out an unintended consequence I saw in a cartoon: As soon as nobody farms cows for meat, milk, and leather, cows will become an endangered species/extinct because nobody will pay to keep them alive. And there's not much space where they could survive on their own in the wild.

People will still use them for riding: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KayizT3NWF8

Re: Ending factory farming as soon as possible

#23
post #8

Just pointing out an unintended consequence I saw in a cartoon: As soon as nobody farms cows for meat, milk, and leather, cows will become an endangered species/extinct because nobody will pay to keep them alive. And there's not much space where they could survive on their own in the wild.

Zoos would likely be collectors of last resort. A lot of people think milk cows in particular are cute.

And they love trombone music.

Re: Ending factory farming as soon as possible

#24
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why doesn't a billionaire just buy up 95% of all the factory farms and start converting them to free range, while lowering output and raising prices? Why don't we as a society subsidize the cost? Would save a lot of lives from suffering. Whatever argument you make against this can also be made in favor of making more cramped prisons and working human prisoners to the bone. Capitalism is designed to exploit externalit…

Couldn't the old owners just open new factory farms and outcompete the now-free range ones by being cheaper?

Well can't the same argument be made for cutting costs in prisons and working inmates to the hilt?

Re: Ending factory farming as soon as possible

#25
post #14
post #8

Just pointing out an unintended consequence I saw in a cartoon: As soon as nobody farms cows for meat, milk, and leather, cows will become an endangered species/extinct because nobody will pay to keep them alive. And there's not much space where they could survive on their own in the wild.

I don't think the main issue is with farming in general, but with factory farming. Raising farm animals in a humane way is a huge improvement.

Who is going to be pay for the raised cost then. Government tax?

Re: Ending factory farming as soon as possible

#26

I think lab-grown meat (if it ever becomes economically feasible) is the only thing that can ever put a dent in factory farming.

I'm all for lab-grown meat but I do question if you'll ever fully satisfy the meat lovers. In my opinion, a better approach would be a hybrid meat/fake meat option which would still make a huge dent in factory farming but appeal to the palates of those who love their cheeseburger. If we can cut down "real" meat consumption by even half, you could in theory make all cows free range.

Why don't you think that lab-grown meat will satisfy meat lovers? Lab grown meat is still biologically meat.

Re: Ending factory farming as soon as possible

#27
Am I the only one who wonders how what the actual difference in suffering is in free range vs. factory farming? There might be a lot of projection going on - people imagining themselves in the same circumstance as the animals and missing the mark because of the differences between our sense of life and that of other animals.

As an example, I once spoke to a person who thought the movie _The March of the Penguins_ was horrific because the penguins just stood there week after week in the freezing cold doing nothing. That may be perfectly fine for a penguin. It might even be like what a adept meditator would experience in a life of meditation.

Re: Ending factory farming as soon as possible

#28
Looking through the different approaches on the list, I am missing one large one. Fishermen are currently throwing away a majority of caught fish because people only buy a very small selection of species (which also differ between nations). We could more than double the amount of fish meat that get eaten without changing the number of fish being killed, and yet for mostly cultural reasons we don't.

Re: Ending factory farming as soon as possible

#29
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Couldn't the old owners just open new factory farms and outcompete the now-free range ones by being cheaper?

Well can't the same argument be made for cutting costs in prisons and working inmates to the hilt?

Of course. That's why you need regulations, not billionaires, in both cases.

Re: Ending factory farming as soon as possible

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm all for lab-grown meat but I do question if you'll ever fully satisfy the meat lovers. In my opinion, a better approach would be a hybrid meat/fake meat option which would still make a huge dent in factory farming but appeal to the palates of those who love their cheeseburger. If we can cut down "real" meat consumption by even half, you could in theory make all cows free range.

Why don't you think that lab-grown meat will satisfy meat lovers? Lab grown meat is still biologically meat.

perhaps it's my ignorance as i haven't tasted it.
Post reply on HN