Interview with Mr. Money Mustache • Hacker News Board

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#121

Post by sephlietz » Wed, Sep 27, 2017, 4:45 PM UTC

gerbilly wrote: post #59

joeax wrote: post #19

I've been reading his blog for a few years, and he does some have some insightful advice on shedding unnecessary expenses and living on a frugal spending diet. I've been able to get down to one car that is almost paid off, and double my savings and investment portfolio. My favorite article from him is living close enough to work to bike (although working from home is most ideal). However, his blog comes with a bit of…

>good luck trying to retire as a welder or car mechanic making $50k. Maybe you don't feel the need to retire at 30 when you are a car mechanic. I've worked in car shops (not as a licensed mechanic) and the mechanics I worked with seemed to have a lot more fun and more free time than us office jockeys despite our 'better jobs.' And the pay wasn't half bad either.

I understand what you are saying (i.e., don't assume to know what a mechanic wants) and you are right. I think his point was that most people don't actually have the freedom to make that choice (live frugally to retire early).

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#122

Post by ringaroundthetx » Wed, Sep 27, 2017, 4:46 PM UTC

sidlls wrote: post #97

CodeCube wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, I find rent-seeking landlords to be an unethical pursuit. I know that's not a mainstream thought, and is the underpinning of many people's income strategy ... but I can't support the idea of letting a family live in a property for decades, and then something happening, and they're on the street with nothing to show for the tens of thousands of dollars they have given in rent.

There are plenty of families who have no interest in buying even if they can afford it easily. One doesn't have to prey on the impoverished to have rental income.

A lot of people don't understand the benefits or recognition of money velocity, but are also not privileged enough to care.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#123

Post by tome » Wed, Sep 27, 2017, 4:46 PM UTC

avenoir wrote: post #37

How much money do you have to have in index funds to live comfortably off dividends? Isn't it an astronomical amount? I have ~$100K in index funds and i'm making about $100 (if even that)/month right now which just gets reinvested. You'd have to have at least half a mil to get any kind of serious money out of this.

You can safely draw down 4% per year according to fairly conservative calculations of MMM.

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/05/29/how-much-do-i-need...

It sounds like you're making 1.2% in dividends, but you can (by this calculation) also sell 2.8% of your investments whilst keeping your total pot above inflation.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#124

Post by nathan_f77 » Wed, Sep 27, 2017, 4:47 PM UTC

dsacco wrote: post #4

Something I’m curious about regarding Mr. Money Mustache - is he actually retired, in the sense that he doesn’t do anything to bring in income (except through passive index investing)? It seems like he has a brand that is pretty lucrative, so it’s unclear to me if he: 1. has enough money to be functionally retired at his current lifestyle, but chooses to continue his brand anyway, 2. has enough money to be functional…

My take was that he followed his own advice and did successfully "retire" without any of the blogging or brand income. Then his blog took off, and he started pulling a lot more money and getting quite famous.

He definitely has enough money to retire forever, but chooses to keep running the blog and doing interviews because he enjoys it, and it's something to do.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#125

Post by maxsilver » Wed, Sep 27, 2017, 4:48 PM UTC

UK-AL wrote: post #82

astura wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He touches on that in this post (with numbers): https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2015/07/27/rent-vs-buy/

Those numbers dont really work in the uk.

No worries, those numbers don't really work in the US either.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#126

Post by ahelwer » Wed, Sep 27, 2017, 4:48 PM UTC

jacquesm wrote: post #94

ahelwer wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This would be a meaningful comment if your critique weren't appallingly mundane.

I don't follow you but that probably makes me a complainypants.

Some critiques or thoughts occur to people near-universally upon exposure to an idea. For example, the HN comments section on scientific studies showing an association between X and Y are packed with people spitballing explanatory theories after a few minutes' thought. Given a certain level of legitimacy of the idea source, it is basically insulting to assume you've thought of a meaningful critique within minutes. Most of the time, these critiques are (to reuse my term) appallingly mundane, obviously considered by the idea source (to assume otherwise is to assume they're idiots, hence insulting) and easily addressed. Beyond this, since many, many people have the exact same mundane thought, it becomes useful to have a shorthand dismissal - here, retirement police.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#127

Post by stlHusker » Wed, Sep 27, 2017, 4:50 PM UTC

ahelwer wrote: post #54

vasilipupkin wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Seems totally stupid. Like why is it better to have 3 jobs ( blog, handyman, landlord ) than one normal job ? to me retired is a person who specifically lives strictly off the money they have. I mean sure, if you prefer to work as a handyman or run a successful blog, by all means do that, but calling yourself retired seems inaccurate. I am retired but I have 3 jobs. ooook.

Ha. The MMM community calls people espousing this sort of view "the retirement police". I have no idea what this complaint intends to accomplish beyond adherence to some kind of radical linguistic prescriptivism. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/02/13/mr-money-mustache-...

You can't claim to be financially independent and come back two years later with this gem:

"The secret is that my wife is no longer really retired, and in fact she started a business that is now big enough to FUND OUR ENTIRE FAMILY'S LIFESTYLE."

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2017/03/06/etsy-shop/

If not outright dishonest, it certainly gives the off appearance that you can't put any weight in the numbers he is throwing out.

I guess I'm one of those "retirement police" who hates seeing a huckster give bad advice while eschewing talking about the real increase in realized risk you take by retiring early and not considering it in your plan. As one of the previous comments stated: your budget is not static, investment returns are not guaranteed, life events and medical situations change drastically.

So when I see, "I made it so can you", I want to respond, "Come back to me when you are 90 and on your death bed and talk with me again." I've seen the cancer treatment bills and what they do to someone with 10x your "financial independent" worth.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#128

Post by hsitz » Wed, Sep 27, 2017, 4:50 PM UTC

kdamken wrote: post #45

dsacco wrote: post #4

Something I’m curious about regarding Mr. Money Mustache - is he actually retired, in the sense that he doesn’t do anything to bring in income (except through passive index investing)? It seems like he has a brand that is pretty lucrative, so it’s unclear to me if he: 1. has enough money to be functionally retired at his current lifestyle, but chooses to continue his brand anyway, 2. has enough money to be functional…

I don't think you know what retired actual means here. It doesn't mean never working again, it more refers to being financially independent. If he wanted to stop all those projects and never do anything again, he could. But that would probably be boring, so he pursues things that interest him, some of which net him income. He's gone over his family's spending before, if you want to read more - http://www.mrmoneymusta…

Yes. Also, I would add that MMM and his wife certainly did retire -- in the sense of quitting their conventional jobs and intending to live off the income, having no need to work. It just happened that in retirement they found themselves wanting to do some things, and those things have produced an income of their own. I'm pretty sure, the moment MMM isn't having fun with what he's currently doing, he'll stop and do something else, which choice will not be driven by how much income it produces. How is that not retirement? (The idea that in retirement you sit around all day and do essentially nothing is, I suppose, true for some people, but surely not a healthy or happy way of living your life.)

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#129

Post by mod » Wed, Sep 27, 2017, 4:50 PM UTC

jk2323 wrote: post #115

joeax wrote: post #19

I've been reading his blog for a few years, and he does some have some insightful advice on shedding unnecessary expenses and living on a frugal spending diet. I've been able to get down to one car that is almost paid off, and double my savings and investment portfolio. My favorite article from him is living close enough to work to bike (although working from home is most ideal). However, his blog comes with a bit of…

He has good ideas but I agree with your arguments. Also, is he retired? How much time does the blog consume? How much income does it generate?

You can read his blog yourself, but the basic idea is that he chooses to run the blog, he's not forced to for financial reasons.

He has enough income from invested savings that he is not required to have more income to maintain his lifestyle.

Re: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache

#130

Post by loeg » Wed, Sep 27, 2017, 4:50 PM UTC

jacquesm wrote: post #66

loeg wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, startups are kind of the antithesis of early retirement.

The few people I know that actually managed to get into early retirement (below 35) were the ones that founded very successful start-ups.

Sure, I should have been more specific. Non-founder startup employment is the antithesis of early retirement.

https://danluu.com/startup-tradeoffs/

And in spite of your personal anecdote, after 13-14 years (35-22) at a BigCo it is certainly possible for anyone who could have founded a successful startup to gross enough money to retire.