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Ask HN: Sell my startup for $14M because I can't raise $2M?

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Re: Ask HN: Sell my startup for $14M because I can't raise $2M?

#321

Post by hexadecimated »

adventured wrote: post #186
hexadecimated wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Such hideously wasteful extravagance, and how sad that these people who are already absurdly rich are still greedy for more.

> Such hideously wasteful extravagance You're moralizing the issue, which points to the fact that most of what you said is nothing more than a personal subjective judgement. For someone with that wealth, it's not usually going to be a wasteful extravagance at all. Billionaires are like large corporations unto themselves. Their business interests are of the scale of small companies in the S&P 500. Take Patterson Compa…

> most of what you said is nothing more than a personal subjective judgement

Indeed it was, I was offering my own considered opinion, not some absolute universal truth.

No surprise such opinions don't go down favourably on HN though. Amidst all the interesting technical and scientific discussion, there are disappointing overtones of wealth worship, and a weird cult-like following of billionaire entrepreneurs.

Re: Ask HN: Sell my startup for $14M because I can't raise $2M?

#322

Post by csmark »

You haven't failed, you've founded a successful startup. Now you're looking at options and obstacles to taking the next step up. Big money, and the potential for even more of it, does weird things to people. Look at where you are at in life and where you want to be personally. The problem with "possibly" is how it can change one's perspective of reality. Others have given you the "take the money advice." I agree with the push both fronts advice. The reality is you have the skills to start a company but finding investors is not your gig.

Options:

Small Business Association - Specifically the 7a Loan which tops out at $5 million. The "Lender Match" program may also be of interest.

Find a lawyer or banker with experience - What sgs1370 said.

Consulting firm or person - If you don't have contacts flush with cash hire someone who does.

Legal council - The cost of a hiring a lawyer is a pittance compared to later realizing you should have done so. Same thing applies to a banker if you sell the company. (Obviously)

Things to consider -

https://hbr.org/2008/02/the-founders-dilemma

Managing a small team of professionals is a different world from finding and managing competent workers. Your daily duties will change dramatically especially if outside investors have a controlling stake in the company.

Re: Ask HN: Sell my startup for $14M because I can't raise $2M?

#323

Post by jonnathanson »

pmorici wrote: post #255
nugget wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have friends who are pilots at the majors who clear $300,000+ a year. Pay has risen substantially since the round of bankruptcies cleared legacy debts. FedEx and UPS apparently pay the most - although I'm not sure why.

Flying cargo is more dangerous than flying people? There is stuff that is banned from being transported in a passenger plane that can be flown in a cargo plane.

I'd also imagine you are logging a lot more hours, facing more intense time pressures, and possibly flying some really irregular or odd-hours routes when you're flying cargo.

Re: Ask HN: Sell my startup for $14M because I can't raise $2M?

#324

Post by jonnathanson »

brianwawok wrote: post #160
qaq wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have no family sure

Not true at all. If you cannot survive on 160k even with a family even in SF, you may want to look at your spending habits.

Let's say I have a child with special needs, be it giftedness or disability. If I want to provide my child with decent care and quality of life in the SF Bay Area, a household income of $160k is going to make things very difficult. Not impossible, but certainly very hard, and likely harder than anywhere else in the country.

In this case my "spending habits," as you put them, might include expenses like routine hospital or clinical bills, specialist care, or some sort of domestic help. Double all of that if my child is physically as well as mentally disabled, or if my child exhibits some sort of prodigy that I want to nurture properly.

You have to remember that the price of goods and services in this local economy is largely driven by those earning some significant multiple of our hypothetical $160,000.

Re: Ask HN: Sell my startup for $14M because I can't raise $2M?

#325

Post by jonnathanson »

gervase wrote: post #146
jonnathanson wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My experience tells me you're lowballing the crew salaries; your pilot alone draws at least $200k. You probably don't pay for the rest of the crew, but you do pay monthly fees for storage, private airstrip clearances, and ad hoc (big) costs each time you fuel it up, 'rent' an attendant, and cater the flight.

I think it really depends on what you expect from your crew. Let's say you have a rotating pool of four 1-2K hour pilots, with 2 on deck for each flight on a week-on/week-off schedule. Skip the 'attendant', have the crew fuel up, and I think you could probably get away with $200K/yr for the personnel costs, depending on taxes/benefits. Obviously the number, length, and complexity of flights would have a big impact as…

Interesting. The calculus is certainly different among billionaires (personal experience sample size = maybe 3 or 4, and no, sadly, I ain't one of 'em myself!).

The billionaires I've met, who by and large own and don't rent, have what I'd call three distinct use cases for private air travel: business, social, and family. Business travel can range from more or less daily to at least 3x per week. Family travel is less frequent and generally limited to whole-family trips, but said trips can and do occur a lot more frequently when you have those means. And then there are what I'd call social trips -- a bucket into which I'd lump anything from charity events, to fundraisers in DC, to golf tournaments, to spur-of-the-moment trips to the house in Aspen or the Hamptons.

Said billionaires, if asked, would consider most of the above to be business trips, because their business lives never stop, and some measure of business is usually baked into most trips -- even if it's a quick stop at one city to conduct business before heading on to the vacation spot.

Re: Ask HN: Sell my startup for $14M because I can't raise $2M?

#326

Post by brianwawok »

jonnathanson wrote: post #324
brianwawok wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not true at all. If you cannot survive on 160k even with a family even in SF, you may want to look at your spending habits.

Let's say I have a child with special needs, be it giftedness or disability. If I want to provide my child with decent care and quality of life in the SF Bay Area, a household income of $160k is going to make things very difficult. Not impossible, but certainly very hard, and likely harder than anywhere else in the country. In this case my "spending habits," as you put them, might include expenses like routine hospit…

I mean, I guess you can have:

* Stop working and live on your 160k per month for life

* Deal with kids special needs

* Live in SF

Pick two

Does this really need stated? Do we need a disclaimer at the bottom of EVERY financial story ( * you may need 10-15% more if your kid has special needs)

Re: Ask HN: Sell my startup for $14M because I can't raise $2M?

#327

Post by jonnathanson »

brianwawok wrote: post #326
jonnathanson wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's say I have a child with special needs, be it giftedness or disability. If I want to provide my child with decent care and quality of life in the SF Bay Area, a household income of $160k is going to make things very difficult. Not impossible, but certainly very hard, and likely harder than anywhere else in the country. In this case my "spending habits," as you put them, might include expenses like routine hospit…

I mean, I guess you can have: * Stop working and live on your 160k per month for life * Deal with kids special needs * Live in SF Pick two Does this really need stated? Do we need a disclaimer at the bottom of EVERY financial story ( * you may need 10-15% more if your kid has special needs)

Sorry if you were somehow offended by my considering the needs of those we rarely consider. You're more than welcome to read through my posting history and see that this is possibly the first time I have ever mentioned the subject on HN. It may well be the last time. And in case it wasn't abundantly obvious through subtext, I'm mentioning it out of personal experience.

I read, and contribute to, quite a few financially oriented threads on HN. I don't see this subject brought up all that often, and certainly not as ubiquitously as you suggest.

I understand what you're trying to say within the narrow context of this thread ('hypothetical: earn $160k and never work again'). It's the whole "Must we hear this every time??? UGH!" aspect of your tone that really bugs me. But this subthread is veering far enough off topic as is, so I'll just leave it at that.

Re: Ask HN: Sell my startup for $14M because I can't raise $2M?

#328

Post by 16bytes »

It looks like you've received a lot of good advice and established at least a couple of conversations from this post.

A nice way to give back to the HN community would be to write up what you decide and what happens next.

I, for one, think that would be really interesting to read.

Re: Ask HN: Sell my startup for $14M because I can't raise $2M?

#329

Post by mijustin »

callmeed wrote: post #39

IMO You need to look into both options until you get at least (a) a letter of intent for acquisition or (b) a term sheet from a VC. If you can, get both, then consider taking the VC money if you can get a significantly higher valuation and good terms. I recall a VC interview recently where he said (paraphrasing) not accepting cold emails and requiring an introduction is a filter that proves you know how to hustle and…

My recommendation is to get a broker. FE International is particularly good: https://feinternational.com/

A good broker should be able to tell you if an offer is fair, and also protect you from the risk of them just doing due diligence to steal your secrets.

Re: Ask HN: Sell my startup for $14M because I can't raise $2M?

#330

Post by crabkilla »

Take the money. The only way you are going to raise money is if you have a VC network or if you are killing it. I mean killing it. You aren't.

Take the money. Relax. And do it again. The company that buys you will fuck it up and then you can fill in the gaps later as Newco.

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