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Uber London loses licence to operate

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Uber London loses licence to operate

#501

Post by sol_remmy »

taormina wrote: post #497
SilasX wrote: post #493

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You could easily build a company that does what Uber does in London without the hate for local Government that is ingrained into Uber's culture - and there already are a number of minicab companies that do what Uber does, just minus quite as fancy an app. But that just begs, er, fully reduces to the question of ... why haven't they? Is a slick, user-friendly app really that much of a barrier? The article has tweets…

Frankly, it happened in Austin. Lyft and Uber threw a hissy fit and the market was happy to fill in the gaps.

> Frankly, it happened in Austin. Lyft and Uber threw a hissy fit and the market was happy to fill in the gaps.

Good luck with that, the markets are not remotely comparable:

Austin: 900k pop; In a red state known for low regulatory burden; No established mass transit to compete with; No established tax companies

London: 8.8M pop; High regulatory burden; City's incentive: each Uber rider is a potential lost customer for the Underground; Taxi companies have influence with legislators

Re: Uber London loses licence to operate

#502

Post by markman »

tomblomfield wrote: post #372

I don't think the Mayor of London or TfL really expect to shut down Uber. It would be a deeply unpopular move. There's an acceptance that Uber has improved things for riders, albeit at the expense of the Black Cab industry, and London wants to welcome innovative technology firms. However, I also suspect that Uber hasn't been as co-operative as TfL would like on several issues mentioned, and so this feels like a warni…

I'm unfamiliar with uber in London or if it's any different than in the United States. I think it's only a matter of time before it gets shut down here and perhaps even have a class action lawsuit by present and former drivers. Uber claims to pay the highest wage at roughly $18/hr. which is a gross overstatement. I watched a Harvard math professor break it down to actually being $2.51/hour. She then outlined what it would take to run a business where the drivers are paid a decent wage, their vehicles are properly serviced & insured, business license, proper taxes, etc. You'll never guess what she came up with. Can you believe it? She came up with a figure that was pretty much identical to the average taxi cab fare today. Isn't that amazing? Imagine that.

Re: Uber London loses licence to operate

#503

Post by DanBC »

Boothroid wrote: post #466
andygates wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm, does that mean they used Greyball in London, or just the known sleazy uses? British regulators, just like CARB, have famously little sense of humour for stuff like that.

In my experience TfL are a pretty crappy organisation themselves. Cab drivers commonly take longer routes in order to inflate their fares. Try complaining about this and see how far you get. Worse, try seeing what happens if you are injured through negligence of a bus driver (as happened to my girlfriend). They will fight you even in spite of incriminating CCTV until they are dragged into court, and only offer to set…

> Cab drivers commonly take longer routes in order to inflate their fares.

Keep a receipt and make a complaint. Longer routes would be really obvious in the taximeter data.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2006/2304/pdfs/uksi_20062...

Re: Uber London loses licence to operate

#504

Post by pebers »

UK-AL wrote: post #383
squigg wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry but you will have to do more to explain your point on black cab user experience being horrendous. Whilst it can be hard to get a hold of one at times, in my experience of 20 years of using them, the user experience is great - the drivers are typically friendly and get you there as quickly as they can. I have used Uber many times in London and abandoned it months ago, as the drivers don't have the local know…

I've had black cab drivers insist that I can't use my card, and that I must get out. I've had cab drivers refuse to drive me to certain parts of London because it's inconvenient for them. They are also really expensive.

I've had the second (refused to be driven) from Uber drivers in London before, except couched in silly excuses like "there are roadworks, it's not possible", and to add insult to injury, marking the ride as complete so I get charged anyway. TBF Uber were extremely prompt about refunding it.

The last point I won't disagree with; Uber is definitely cheaper, qualitatively so, such that you'd consider it for trips that you'd never take a black cab for.

Re: Uber London loses licence to operate

#505

Post by conanbatt »

Nursie wrote: post #375
conanbatt wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taxis have an ACTUAL monopoly. Are you seriously siding with "banning potential monopoly" to protect an entrenched centuries old monopoly.

>> Taxis have an ACTUAL monopoly Not really, there are lots of private-hire firms in London. >> Are you seriously siding with "banning potential monopoly" to protect an entrenched centuries old monopoly. Nope. That's a wilful misreading of what I've been posting and I'm not sure it warrants much response. I'm siding with protecting a diverse market from an unethical company who appear to be bending the rules and sink…

> Not really, there are lots of private-hire firms in London.

If thats your definition of monopoly, then UBER is also not a monopoly. Those still exist and can continue to exist.

> I'm siding with protecting a diverse market

You are not siding with protecting a diverse market because you are eliminating an option. Its the exact opposite direction. The rules are written by the same people that invented taxicabs. If the rules are removed, UBER would not be bending any rules. Its a problem created exclusively by the government, and uber drivers and passengers are being disregarded. This is what people want, and you are advocating for restricting those people in favor of another.

To help one side, you are advocating the attack of another one. That is not an even standing.

Re: Uber London loses licence to operate

#506

Post by pebers »

Sean1708 wrote: post #364
mittermayr wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, in restaurants now the tip's already on the bill, unless you want to make your entire group or date uncomfortable by "talking to the waiter about taking it off".

To be fair, I've only ever seen this in expensive restaurants.

Really? I've seen it in heaps of places in London - adding 12.5% "gratuity" is common at many places where you'd pay ~£15+ pp.

Re: Uber London loses licence to operate

#507

Post by dominotw »

vkou wrote: post #482
dx034 wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not even sure how you would convince them. Full code and database audit isn't easy nor cheap and I doubt Uber wants to pay for that. Apart from that, there's no way to detect if Uber runs services to detect regulators.

Open up your books. The problem is that once you have a history of unethical behaviour, nobody believes you when you say 'don't worry, trust me'.

were they given a chance to "convince" ? are they banned forever then?

Re: Uber London loses licence to operate

#508

Post by harryh »

walshemj wrote: post #431
harryh wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not all their profits. Just the profits that occur outside of the US. The US corporate tax system is relatively unusual in that it attempts to tax not just profits earned within it's borders but worldwide profits for any company incorporated within the US. So what US companies tend to do is incorporate subsidiaries in tax friendly locales like the Caribbean (Ireland is also popular) to avoid paying US corporate taxes…

Its why apple has that massive cash pile off shore

Yup, exactly.

Re: Uber London loses licence to operate

#509

Post by dominotw »

alex_duf wrote: post #180
sambe wrote: post #16

When I have reported black cab drivers misleading passengers, lying about pricing and regulations or bus drivers driving dangerously and being rude to everyone, TfL are totally uninterested. They give the impression that they know the scams operate and don't care. It's an interesting comparison with my Uber experience, which has been almost flawless and issues are usually fixed by Uber themselves promptly.

Or the card machine that is "broken"

one cabbie took me hostage till we found an ATM.

Re: Uber London loses licence to operate

#510

Post by sol_remmy »

vertex-four wrote: post #500
sol_remmy wrote: post #498

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You could easily build a company that does what Uber does in London without the hate for local Government that is ingrained into Uber's culture You act like Uber flaunting local flaws is a flaw for the company. Ignoring 10,000 different sets of local laws in all the localities Uber operates is what made them successful. It would have been impossible to expand as much as they had if the bothered dealing with the loc…

Indeed. Perhaps it would be difficult to replicate what Uber did in SF and other US cities without breaking regulations - but in London, their model is perfectly replicable, as evidenced by the fact that they were originally given a license by TfL.

But here's an even better model: 1. Do a good job 2. Consumers use your service & rely on you 3. Wait for the government to try to shut you down 4. Consumers will back you 5. Government backs down & lets you do what you want
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