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Golang Proposal: Just Use GitHub

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Re: Golang Proposal: Just Use GitHub

#61

Post by throwaway2016a »

sli wrote: post #58
maaaats wrote: post #4

Kinda scary how de facto Github has become, that external tooling is discouraged. Github is a bad issue tracker, a bad code review tool, an ok wiki and a bad distribution platform. Still, one has to mostly use the whole package to get contributors. (Github has other strengths, though)

One thing Github does that really bothers me is that if your paid account lapses, you must pay to get your private repos back. You don't have the option to simply set your repos to public. The only options Github gives you is pay money or lose your repos. As far as I care, that's practically extortion. So I moved to Gitlab. Luckily, Github screwed up and temporarily unlocked my private repos, letting me grab the ones…

That's interesting. I was under the impression they became read-only not completely inaccessible.

Re: Golang Proposal: Just Use GitHub

#62

Post by lloeki »

danpalmer wrote: post #50
bmh_ca wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aside: In your opinion what are good issue trackers and code review tools?

I'd also be interested in knowing. I also feel GitHub's issue tracker is not right for a large project like this. As for the code review tools though, I've not yet seen something that I feel is materially better than GitHub + PRs + some bot-enabled automation. I understand that many people _prefer_ things like Gerrit, but I've found the difference to mostly be opinion, and that Gerrit can be a significant problem in…

GitLab's threaded, resolvable discussions is very efficient, especially if you enable mandatory resolution before merge, forcing you to create issues for unresolved ones through the related button, guaranteeing you never loose track of something that should be resolved. I have a hard time going back to GitHub because it's so useful.

Re: Golang Proposal: Just Use GitHub

#63

Post by hellofunk »

Androider wrote: post #31
hellofunk wrote: post #22

If one wants to see the merits or at least the experiences of a major language from a commercial entity going open source on GitHub, where all discussions, language features, issues, and code itself is in that one place, take a look at Apple's Swift. Edit: Looks like Swift doesn't use GH for issues any more.

Swift doesn't seem to be using GitHub's issue tracker, wikis or anything except the code hosting really.

Well they use code files for discussions, so it's a bit different.

Re: Golang Proposal: Just Use GitHub

#64

Post by sytse »

giancarlostoro wrote: post #6
maaaats wrote: post #4

Kinda scary how de facto Github has become, that external tooling is discouraged. Github is a bad issue tracker, a bad code review tool, an ok wiki and a bad distribution platform. Still, one has to mostly use the whole package to get contributors. (Github has other strengths, though)

BitBucket is plenty popular as well, I run into projects that are on there instead of GH for Python. I kind of prefer BitBucket to GitHub the only thing GitHub does right is their "Explore" section which I don't think BitBucket has (or GitLab?) but that's about it for me. I don't care where one hosts code, as long as it's not some obscure server.

GitLab has an explore section https://gitlab.com/explore but it isn't as good as GitHub's one. Both to having less projects and us spending less time on it.

Re: Golang Proposal: Just Use GitHub

#65

Post by jballanc »

> When Google keeps the canonical git repo in googlesource, and uses a google-run gerrit instance for code reviews, it does not make the project feel like it's open source. It makes it feel like it's a google project that they let the rest of us look at from afar, and participate in if we're willing to hike up the mountain.

I hate to break it to ya', but I think this isn't just what it feels like.

The sooner people realize that "Open Source" is different than "Open Development", the better. That said, I think it's a stretch to assume that Go is contributor hostile just because it hasn't gone all-in on GitHub. Just off the top of my head: Ruby, Python, Javascript, Lua, Clojure, C++, and Java are all languages that haven't embraced the "GitHub Workflow". Indeed, the only language I can think of that has is Julia. Actually, I just checked, and it looks like Rust is also bought in to the GitHub Workflow. So that makes it: 2 for, 7+ against.

Re: Golang Proposal: Just Use GitHub

#66

Post by steveklabnik »

jballanc wrote: post #65

> When Google keeps the canonical git repo in googlesource, and uses a google-run gerrit instance for code reviews, it does not make the project feel like it's open source. It makes it feel like it's a google project that they let the rest of us look at from afar, and participate in if we're willing to hike up the mountain. I hate to break it to ya', but I think this isn't just what it feels like. The sooner people r…

Ruby historically has not wanted to move to GitHub because core prefers svn to git.

That said, https://github.com/ruby/ruby/ exists, and committers will (in my understanding) take PRs from it and merge them in, see https://github.com/ruby/ruby/pull/1661 for example.

This has happened because the same kinds of discussions have come up with Ruby for years, especially since GitHub came out of the Ruby world, and the Ruby community overall has used GitHub longer and more than most as a result.

There are things that we in Rust find annoying about GitHub, but they're mostly addressed through things like bots; there's no significant push by anyone to move away from GitHub.

Re: Golang Proposal: Just Use GitHub

#67

Post by matt4077 »

arkadiytehgraet wrote: post #48
lloeki wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If one cannot figure out how to setup a development environment (with detailed guides), how can one be expected to actually make a meaningful contribution in a much more difficult domain like compiler development? Because those are two unrelated fields, and one is distinctly not productive. From the issue: > I ran through the contributing workshop at Gophercon 2017. I even had gone through half of it before. I stil…

>Because those are two unrelated fields, and one is distinctly not productive. I beg to differ: they are both about solving problems; one set of problems (setting up development environment) is strictly easier in terms of cognitive load and actual technical ability than the other (compiler development). If you cannot solve problems from the first set, you simply cannot solve problems from the last. >And comments (fro…

> they are both about solving problems;

My car won't start. Shouldn't Google solve that first, before attempting to further improve search results? It's really easy to solve. (I lost the key)

Re: Golang Proposal: Just Use GitHub

#68

Post by agnivade »

shadowmint wrote: post #5

Unfortunately the epic comment thread, very talky, none of the key stack holders involved, largely irrelevant chatter... Is a case in point of why github isn't the answer for everything.

> none of the key stack holders involved,

Robert Griesemer, Ian Lance Taylor have put in their comments (apart from other core contributors).

So, I would say this statement is false now.

Re: Golang Proposal: Just Use GitHub

#69

Post by marssaxman »

Sir_Cmpwn wrote: post #45
coldtea wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Each of your examples is something like "I've been writing go for x years". Using a programming langauge does not make you a compiler hacker. Becoming an expert on whatever custom commit process a project has does even less to make you a compiler hacker.

Correct, but the inverse is typically true - not being willing to learn anything but GitHub is a pretty good indicator for not being able to hack on compilers.

I am able to hack on compilers and have spent much of my career doing so. I am also able to learn new development workflows involving idiosyncratic tools which must be installed and configured; I've done it over and over, at many different jobs. You know what? It's a lot of work, and it's all basically a waste of time. I'll do it if I'm paid to, but I'm not interested in spending my free time that way.

Re: Golang Proposal: Just Use GitHub

#70

Post by matt4077 »

Tade0 wrote: post #47
coldtea wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt the GitHub thread was "a long poem, typically one derived from ancient oral tradition, narrating the deeds and adventures of heroic or legendary figures or the past history of a nation"

You're confusing a noun with an adjective. As an adjective it's something that's "extending beyond the usual or ordinary especially in size or scope".

The adjective is obviously. derived from the noun, and as such had much of the same meaning originally: "relating to or characteristic of an epic or epics: our national epic poem Beowulf."

And no, I'm not proud of having to weigh in on this subject.

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