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EFF to Court: The First Amendment Protects the Right to Record First Responders

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Re: EFF to Court: The First Amendment Protects the Right to Record First Responders

#11
post #6

I have an engineering question: Is there any negative feedback for police who violate peoples rights like this? I don't mean theoretically. I mean practically, is there any negative feedback? The reason this is an engineering question is I think we all know what happens to control systems without negative feedback.

What sort of negative feedback do you mean? Termination/jail time, negative annual reviews, or something else?

Re: EFF to Court: The First Amendment Protects the Right to Record First Responders

#12
post #6

I have an engineering question: Is there any negative feedback for police who violate peoples rights like this? I don't mean theoretically. I mean practically, is there any negative feedback? The reason this is an engineering question is I think we all know what happens to control systems without negative feedback.

The only negative consequences are to the taxpayer that has to pay to settle these things out of court. Would be nice if the arresting officers were held financially liable to some degree and then you can bet they'd make a better effort to be sure they were making lawful arrests.

Re: EFF to Court: The First Amendment Protects the Right to Record First Responders

#13
post #6

I have an engineering question: Is there any negative feedback for police who violate peoples rights like this? I don't mean theoretically. I mean practically, is there any negative feedback? The reason this is an engineering question is I think we all know what happens to control systems without negative feedback.

Their employer can be sued, like in this case and the other referenced in the article. I don't think there is any significant feedback for individual officers unless these suits become common.

Re: EFF to Court: The First Amendment Protects the Right to Record First Responders

#14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I talked someone out of a night in prison once. There was a payment dispute at a night club and the owner brought the police. The guy in question then started talking about their legal rights, and all the lawyers they know and thats where I interjected "you could just pay with your credit card and initiate a charge back, let the credit card company deal with it, because you'll still spend the night in jail otherwise…

Sometimes the best way to avoid conflict is to embrace it, then channel. I was in a bar once, sitting at the bar enjoying a beer, when the guy to the left of me recognized the guy to the left. "Hey! Are you X?" "Sure." "I'm going to kick your ass!" I looked at the guy and said "Hell yeah! Why don't you guys go out into the parking lot and get this thing settled?" He didn't want to do that. Instead he wanted to keep t…

Reminds me of the time I was sitting at a bar, facing some friends. A guy came up behind me and king hit the guy sitting behind me full in the face.

I didn't see it, just the reactions of my friend's faces who saw the whole thing. Apparently my head was only inches away from being involved.

...The guy who got hit died, the other one was charged with manslaughter.

Re: EFF to Court: The First Amendment Protects the Right to Record First Responders

#15
post #6

I have an engineering question: Is there any negative feedback for police who violate peoples rights like this? I don't mean theoretically. I mean practically, is there any negative feedback? The reason this is an engineering question is I think we all know what happens to control systems without negative feedback.

Nothing consistent or substantial enough to have any meaningful effect.

Re: EFF to Court: The First Amendment Protects the Right to Record First Responders

#16
post #6

I have an engineering question: Is there any negative feedback for police who violate peoples rights like this? I don't mean theoretically. I mean practically, is there any negative feedback? The reason this is an engineering question is I think we all know what happens to control systems without negative feedback.

The only negative consequences are to the taxpayer that has to pay to settle these things out of court. Would be nice if the arresting officers were held financially liable to some degree and then you can bet they'd make a better effort to be sure they were making lawful arrests.

This is an interesting thought. Like other professions which have license to affect an individual physically, such as doctors, perhaps the first responders should carry some type of "malpractice" malpractice insurance.

Re: EFF to Court: The First Amendment Protects the Right to Record First Responders

#18
post #6

I have an engineering question: Is there any negative feedback for police who violate peoples rights like this? I don't mean theoretically. I mean practically, is there any negative feedback? The reason this is an engineering question is I think we all know what happens to control systems without negative feedback.

From a controls standpoint, it's clear there's no negative feedback sufficient to offset the feedback from getting their way.

Re: EFF to Court: The First Amendment Protects the Right to Record First Responders

#19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only negative consequences are to the taxpayer that has to pay to settle these things out of court. Would be nice if the arresting officers were held financially liable to some degree and then you can bet they'd make a better effort to be sure they were making lawful arrests.

This is an interesting thought. Like other professions which have license to affect an individual physically, such as doctors, perhaps the first responders should carry some type of "malpractice" malpractice insurance.

It's turtles all the way down though. If police need to carry malpractice insurance then the cost will have to be built into salary which is paid by the taxpayers. It might be cheaper to just have the state pay out then pay for a bunch of individual insurance policies.

Re: EFF to Court: The First Amendment Protects the Right to Record First Responders

#20
post #6

I have an engineering question: Is there any negative feedback for police who violate peoples rights like this? I don't mean theoretically. I mean practically, is there any negative feedback? The reason this is an engineering question is I think we all know what happens to control systems without negative feedback.

Feedback could work if the fiction of qualified immunity were eliminated. If police officers were held to the same criminal standards as non-police it would make them think twice.
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