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Automotive Grade Linux Platform Debuts on the 2018 Toyota Camry

automotivelinux.org

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Re: Automotive Grade Linux Platform Debuts on the 2018 Toyota Camry

#31

Post by pokstad »

sircastor wrote: post #26

Infotainment system developer here, A number of people have mentioned preferring/wanting Android Auto/CarPlay in their infotainment systems, and that it would be preferable to many of the systems that exist in current vehicles. I have a couple of thoughts. The Infotainment system is one of the most user-facing components of the vehicle. It's something that can reflect the brand identity of the vehicle, and most OEMs…

“It’s not CarPlay” absolutely helps. I don’t care if Toyota makes a decent infotainment system. I will not buy a Toyota or Lexus until they come with a CarPlay option. Period. It’s a waste of time to elaborate on that (for free). I would rather save my breath and vote with my money by supporting a car company that does understand my needs (e.g. Honda/Acura).

Re: Automotive Grade Linux Platform Debuts on the 2018 Toyota Camry

#32

Post by tjr225 »

rothbardrand wrote: post #7

I've been a loyal toyota buyer for over 30 years. But I will not buy another car, unless it has first class CarPlay support. (and it should support the android equivalent as well) Having to interact with the phone while driving is a safety problem and Apple (and presumably android too) delivered a great solution several years ago-- no excuse for not implementing it. Especially given that auto makers really suck at th…

May be off topic but it's funny to see complaints regarding infotainment systems when all I've done is driven 10 year old toyotas without infotainment systemsfor the past decade. "More money, more problems."

Re: Automotive Grade Linux Platform Debuts on the 2018 Toyota Camry

#33

Post by TickleSteve »

ausjke wrote: post #13

Checked the software stack, it's basically: Yocto(OS framework) + Tizen(application framework) + Genivi(infotainment). Yocto is totally over-engineered and only RTOS vendors really enjoy it as they can sell services on top of that, it's a nightmare for small players, they should just use Buildroot the alternative to save money and time. Tizen has never reached what it wanted to be, partially because of Android. Geniv…

Absolutely... Yocto is definitely massively complex compared to BuildRoot. Yocto is difficult to maintain and inflexible despite attempting to be exactly those things. A prime example of over-engineering. In comparison, BuildRoot uses well-known mechanisms and is much simpler to use as a result.

Re: Automotive Grade Linux Platform Debuts on the 2018 Toyota Camry

#34

Post by icantdrive55 »

rothbardrand wrote: post #7

I've been a loyal toyota buyer for over 30 years. But I will not buy another car, unless it has first class CarPlay support. (and it should support the android equivalent as well) Having to interact with the phone while driving is a safety problem and Apple (and presumably android too) delivered a great solution several years ago-- no excuse for not implementing it. Especially given that auto makers really suck at th…

I just want a vechicle I can put 290,000 miles on.

I wish Toyota would strip any sensor, or any bit if software that isn't critical.

I don't know what CarPlay is, but if it's an entertainment system--I rather Toyota do what they used to be kings at; simple, well engineered cars, that are affordable, and last.

And I don't mind installing third party entertainment gadgets myself. Actually just a radio is fine. I don't want to be connected all the time, especially when driving.

Oh yea, and as my father use to say, "Put me out, the day I can roll up my own windows."

Me and my father are completely different, but had similar views on vechicles. Common sense engineering. Reasonably priced. Probally, because we did all the repairs on our own vechicles?

Re: Automotive Grade Linux Platform Debuts on the 2018 Toyota Camry

#36

Post by pfranz »

sircastor wrote: post #26

Infotainment system developer here, A number of people have mentioned preferring/wanting Android Auto/CarPlay in their infotainment systems, and that it would be preferable to many of the systems that exist in current vehicles. I have a couple of thoughts. The Infotainment system is one of the most user-facing components of the vehicle. It's something that can reflect the brand identity of the vehicle, and most OEMs…

It just feels like nobody uses these things (or they're so resource constrained their first iteration made it into production). I bought a 2015 Honda Fit knowing it'd been out awhile and there was no change for 2016 (I hoped this meant many things, including their infotainment system had things ironed out). I also got the lowest-end infotainment system because I wanted a volume knob instead of soft buttons. It's funny how with professional cameras the high end have more physical buttons, while it's the opposite for car stereos. I'd rather turn a knob than grope the dash to mash down on a touchscreen while driving.

I've tried to "learn" the system.

* there's a mess of apps to download and it's unclear which work with the tier of sound system I got and they completely oversell what they do.

* there's no way they're going to do a better job at GPS and directions (my tier wasn't supported, but I didn't know that until I downloaded their app and figured it out myself)

* it makes no sense to have a separate voice dialing from Siri (it's unclear that it's separate, it's just terrible at it, and it's unclear on how to train new names)

* it auto-connects known phones and starts playing random songs. I know that's part of Bluetooth, but if the wrong device connects they bury device swapping multiple menus deep and you have to "disconnect" the old devices and "connect" the correct one instead of just connecting to the phone you want

* they separate bluetooth phone and audio--you have to connect your phone to each one. I get this is a "feature" but it just confuses things. I doubt most people know there's a distinction

* plugging into USB (to charge) does not mean I want to switch audio over--I use a cigarette lighter USB adapter to get rid of this confusion

* features differ between USB attached device and Bluetooth even for things that they both could technically support (i.e. album artwork doesn't show up over Bluetooth but does over USB). I would forget which is attached--I doubt most people understand the distinction. Again, not using USB solved this.

* and really, most importantly, don't crash. If you do (which happens at least monthly), don't make me turn the car off to restart it.

I'm not intending to rant at you. I've told my dealer about the crashing issue and asked if there were any updates (there weren't), the rest I've learned to live with since I don't plan on buying a new car for 10+ years. I now plan to write a letter.

Re: Automotive Grade Linux Platform Debuts on the 2018 Toyota Camry

#37

Post by m_mueller »

tjr225 wrote: post #32
rothbardrand wrote: post #7

I've been a loyal toyota buyer for over 30 years. But I will not buy another car, unless it has first class CarPlay support. (and it should support the android equivalent as well) Having to interact with the phone while driving is a safety problem and Apple (and presumably android too) delivered a great solution several years ago-- no excuse for not implementing it. Especially given that auto makers really suck at th…

May be off topic but it's funny to see complaints regarding infotainment systems when all I've done is driven 10 year old toyotas without infotainment systemsfor the past decade. "More money, more problems."

Why do I even need this? Just give me a bluetooth receiver and a usb outlet for the phone. You set up the navi before driving off, just like you would in the built-in systems. I don't understand why carplay is such a big deal tbh.

Re: Automotive Grade Linux Platform Debuts on the 2018 Toyota Camry

#38

Post by sircastor »

BoorishBears wrote: post #24
subway wrote: post #3

Based on everything I've read about automotive software development, I'm impressed they've managed to degrade the Linux kernel enough to call it Automotive Grade.

I found out my car's infotainment system can run HTML/Js/CSS apps. The performance guidelines give you a great hint about the hardware (or lack thereof), they discourage using percentages for example. And have strict versions of Angular 1 and jQuery you're allowed to use

Mazda by chance(?) - I've worked in this space, they're interesting systems. A number of OEMs have explored web stacks as an option for applications. It's very accessible for vendors to work with. Dealing with the system resource limitations is a huge deal.

Re: Automotive Grade Linux Platform Debuts on the 2018 Toyota Camry

#39

Post by BoorishBears »

sircastor wrote: post #38
BoorishBears wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I found out my car's infotainment system can run HTML/Js/CSS apps. The performance guidelines give you a great hint about the hardware (or lack thereof), they discourage using percentages for example. And have strict versions of Angular 1 and jQuery you're allowed to use

Mazda by chance(?) - I've worked in this space, they're interesting systems. A number of OEMs have explored web stacks as an option for applications. It's very accessible for vendors to work with. Dealing with the system resource limitations is a huge deal.

GM/OnStar's "Next Generation Infotainment" headunits

Re: Automotive Grade Linux Platform Debuts on the 2018 Toyota Camry

#40

Post by csours »

m_mueller wrote: post #37
tjr225 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

May be off topic but it's funny to see complaints regarding infotainment systems when all I've done is driven 10 year old toyotas without infotainment systemsfor the past decade. "More money, more problems."

Why do I even need this? Just give me a bluetooth receiver and a usb outlet for the phone. You set up the navi before driving off, just like you would in the built-in systems. I don't understand why carplay is such a big deal tbh.

Bigger screen in a better place; it uses your car mic instead of the phone mic; it uses your steering wheel buttons instead of needing to touch the phone; when you get a call or want to talk to the system, the A/C turns down the blower setting. Probably some others.
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