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Florida Power and Light: Regulations for home solar installations

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Re: Florida Power and Light: Regulations for home solar installations

#91

Post by maxerickson »

SigmundA wrote: post #77
homero wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't run loads from cells directly, you need a battery and inverters. Or every cloud will fluctuate the voltage and watts massively and your electronics will fry. In the olden days, flickering incandescent would be fine.

Not exactly accurate. My Dad has a 7kw array grid-tie no battery system in FL. It has a single emergency outlet that will provide up 1500w when the grid is down. With the power being down last week from Irma it was able to output at least a 1000w load even with heavy overcast. It will off course shut off if it can't provide the attached load. If you have a solar system for home its going to have an inverter, but most…

Does his system meet code?

If so, it demonstrates that the article is, uh, not well researched.

Re: Florida Power and Light: Regulations for home solar installations

#92

Post by awful »

cptskippy wrote: post #41
oconnore wrote: post #8

The article is trying so hard it's hard to tell what the actual issue is. It is dangerous to backfeed the grid -- you may kill the line worker coming to fix a blown transformer or downed line. In some places a grid connection is considered necessary by the building code. If so, you must use proper equipment.

There's no citation or research about the laws in question in this article, or the Miami New Times article it cites as a source, or the WFTV article that it sources. From what I gathered in reading the three articles there's a state code that mandates that homes must be hooked up to the electrical grid. With out seeing the law or it's history (e.g. when it was mandated), it's difficult to say if it's malice on the pa…

Florida has/had historically issues with power, especially as populations rose; the utilities were only willing to build generators if they could be guaranteed recovery. All this wasn't just about homes, but the power needs of the entire commercial, public, and safety infrastructure too.

Re: Florida Power and Light: Regulations for home solar installations

#93

Post by 24gttghh »

wallace_f wrote: post #7
crististm wrote: post #2

This seems to be straight from a dystopian movie or book I'm not sure it isn't a joke. Is the "get off my lawn" a thing of the past in US? What business have US gov, or anybody else for that matter, to do with what I do on my property?

Most states wont even allow you to collect your own rain water to drink it.

There only appears to be a single state (Colorado) where collecting rainwater is strictly regulated,[0] and in most states (31) it is not illegal/no regulation/even encouraged. A further 9 states regulate and encourage rainwater collection, and then Texas provides incentives to do so. The remaining 5 states simply have regulations around rainwater collection.

[0]https://energy.gov/eere/femp/rainwater-harvesting-regulation...

Re: Florida Power and Light: Regulations for home solar installations

#94

Post by KGIII »

ubernostrum wrote: post #49
gnode wrote: post #17

The title of this article is quite misleading. It's not saying that it's illegal to have solar panels powering your home, only to have a solar system that does not tie into the grid. Then making it seem that requiring anti-islanding protection is some act of malice.

The controversy is over what happens when the power supplied via the grid goes out. There are generally two options that could be taken here, in light of the argument that a powered house connected to an unpowered grid is unsafe: 1. Any solar system on the house would be required to shut off at the same time, leaving the house without power from any source, or 2. A solar system on the house could continue to provide…

The ability to lock it is almost certainly for lock-out, tag-out reasons. They will come ensure you're disconnected and then just one person has the key to the lock they put on it. That one person isn't the supervisor, but the person doing the work. If more than one person work on it, they will all put locks on it.

Re: Florida Power and Light: Regulations for home solar installations

#96

Post by ideonexus »

Clubber wrote: post #15
oconnore wrote: post #8

The article is trying so hard it's hard to tell what the actual issue is. It is dangerous to backfeed the grid -- you may kill the line worker coming to fix a blown transformer or downed line. In some places a grid connection is considered necessary by the building code. If so, you must use proper equipment.

Yes, it's required for generators too. You have to install some sort of switch (I forgot what it's called) so the house power doesn't feed back into the grid and kill a lineman. The title is very misleading as well. Just goes to show that Fox News and their ilk aren't the only ones who do fake news, it's journalism in general. Also, the title is an outright lie: "Thanks to Lobbying, It's Illegal to Power Your Home wi…

IFLScience is not "journalism in general." The acronym stands for "I F*%ing Love Science" and it got started as a Facebook page made popular for posting science-joke memes. The site and FB page, both run by Elise Andrew, are both fairly disliked in the Science Online community for misrepresenting studies, disseminating false information, and chronic copyright violations as she blatantly steals photos and art from others and fails to give credit.

This wikipedia article covers just a little of what Elise Andrew is guilty of:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elise_Andrew#Criticism_and_acc...

Links to this site have no business on HN.

Re: Florida Power and Light: Regulations for home solar installations

#97

Post by kbutler »

Hysterical article is hysterical?

The actual laws are more reasonable:

"Renewable generator systems connected to the grid without batteries are not a standby power source during an FPL outage. The system must shut down when FPL's grid shuts down in order to prevent dangerous back feed on FPL's grid. This is required to protect FPL employees who may be working on the grid."

Note the "without batteries" exclusion a similar exclusion applies to the cutoff switch when the grid is down, to protect line workers.

https://www.fpl.com/clean-energy/net-metering/guidelines.htm...

Re: Florida Power and Light: Regulations for home solar installations

#98

Post by xenophonf »

In Africa we've built small home/lab/datacenter power systems that charge a battery bank off utility mains plus on-site generation. It's basically a gigantic UPS that can automatically switch among a variety of power inputs. What's stopping someone from building something like that here in the U.S.? Charge batteries from solar, supplement with mains power, maybe even add a diesel generator for extreme emergencies, and use an automatic transfer switch to prevent backfeeding the utility mains (which is super dangerous to line workers and probably the reason for Florida's regulation). Not being a power systems guy myself, I don't see where the flaws in such a design are. Any EEs out there who care to comment?

Re: Florida Power and Light: Regulations for home solar installations

#99

Post by maxerickson »

24gttghh wrote: post #93
wallace_f wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most states wont even allow you to collect your own rain water to drink it.

There only appears to be a single state (Colorado) where collecting rainwater is strictly regulated,[0] and in most states (31) it is not illegal/no regulation/even encouraged. A further 9 states regulate and encourage rainwater collection, and then Texas provides incentives to do so. The remaining 5 states simply have regulations around rainwater collection. [0] https://energy.gov/eere/femp/rainwater-harvesting-regu…

That page even links technical documents about collecting rainwater for household use:

https://extension.psu.edu/rainwater-cisterns-design-construc...

Re: Florida Power and Light: Regulations for home solar installations

#100

Post by ams6110 »

kbutler wrote: post #97

Hysterical article is hysterical? The actual laws are more reasonable: "Renewable generator systems connected to the grid without batteries are not a standby power source during an FPL outage. The system must shut down when FPL's grid shuts down in order to prevent dangerous back feed on FPL's grid. This is required to protect FPL employees who may be working on the grid." Note the "without batteries" exclusion a sim…

It sounds reasonable but the way to do this is with a device called a transfer switch. It's used on any proper installation of local power such as a home generator. When the utility power is out, the transfer switch cuts over to local power. There is no feedback to the outside power lines; the transfer switch disconnects them. Are home generators illegal also?
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