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Top medical experts say we should decriminalize all drugs (2016)

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Re: Top medical experts say we should decriminalize all drugs (2016)

#31

Post by anythingnonidin »

rectang wrote: post #27
anythingnonidin wrote: post #21

Some reasons for decriminalization of use and possession, summarized: (i.e., removing criminal penalties or making it no jail time possible, but not government supplied) - War on drugs has failed. Criminalization has consequences on community - in many cases, most of the negative effects come from the criminalization, not the drug. - Consensual crimes that don’t harm others shouldn’t be crimes. - Drug prohibition doe…

The main reason we won't get decriminalization is moral panic. :( But if we did... There are still better and worse ways to make drugs available. Same as with alcohol, addicts doing high volume are where the money is -- and it's better to design regimes that prevent commercial actors from abusing vulnerable populations. Mark Kleiman has a lot of great stuff to say on the subject.

How did you discover Kleiman's work? I read his 'Marijuana Legalization' over the weekend, and have previously read his 'Drugs and Drug Policy.'

Re: Top medical experts say we should decriminalize all drugs (2016)

#32

Post by microcolonel »

jeffdavis wrote: post #28

"scientific consensus" I am very troubled by this phrase -- it's almost an oxymoron. Science is not democratic, and scientists aren't anointed arbiters of facts. Anyone can be a scientist simply by following the scientific method and collecting data in good faith; and a lone outsider with new data can challenge 100 years of "consensus". Obviously they are subject to challenges themselves, or if it's unlikely enough t…

Yeah, as much as I agree with the policy position, I detest the "scientific consensus" speak. It's exactly the slimy approach to engaging the public which has made something as straightforward as climate change controversial.

Re: Top medical experts say we should decriminalize all drugs (2016)

#33

Post by KGIII »

mc32 wrote: post #25
fsloth wrote: post #5

Finally. I hope this will signal a turning point on this insane approach to national health in all countries. Drugs are a health problem, not a criminal problem. Lone experts have been fired in western countries when they have expressed this common sense sentiments alone [0]. I hope this groups fares better. Nixon started the war on drugs anyway as a mean to attack left and black activists [1]. Any previous legislati…

I'll agree with consumption not being punishable but a medically treatable issue. Misditribution (illegal distribution) of controlled dugs (not over the counter) should be punishable --whether they be doctors who knowingly over prescribe or black market sellers (drug dealers).

So then make it not illegal?

Re: Top medical experts say we should decriminalize all drugs (2016)

#34

Post by int_19h »

Johnny555 wrote: post #8
ars wrote: post #7

And not just recreational drugs. All drugs. We trust people to manage their own life, this includes medicine. Maybe insurance won't pay for it without a Dr, but if someone wants to self pay, that's their choice.

There are lots of reasons to keep many drugs available as prescription-only. Misuse of antibiotics affects everyone, not just the person taking them. Plus, drug interactions are hard even for professionals to manage. I don't think it's a good idea to let people self-prescribe prescription drugs for themselves and others (like their children).

Possession and use should remain legal in all cases. This is pretty basic privacy and body autonomy rights.

Distribution can be regulated.

Re: Top medical experts say we should decriminalize all drugs (2016)

#36

Post by leksak »

brndnmtthws wrote: post #15
gremlinsinc wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, but if someone somehow gets a hold of drugs--and puts it in their body they shouldn't go to jail for that... putting substances in one's own body doesn't necessarily hurt others--unless they become violent as a result - but until they commit some violent crime hopped up on meth -- innocent till guilty of a violent crime. Morality and what not should not be forced on people. And most people with drug dependen…

You might be able to make the argument that someone who abuses antibiotics to the point of turning themselves into a walking incubator of drug-resistant bacteria does pose some risk to the general public. There should be a good middle ground here: one where people have access to drugs, but there's some accountability (or at least a speed bump) to prevent people from causing harm to themselves or others. I think we al…

It'll be interesting to see if testosterone, human growth hormone and steroids will also be legal to use and posses outside of professional sports

Re: Top medical experts say we should decriminalize all drugs (2016)

#37

Post by leksak »

shakna wrote: post #20
ars wrote: post #7

And not just recreational drugs. All drugs. We trust people to manage their own life, this includes medicine. Maybe insurance won't pay for it without a Dr, but if someone wants to self pay, that's their choice.

There's a whole class of drugs guaranteed to kill your child during pregnancy, and another where the interactions may seriously harm the child. Another where two relatively harmless drugs, when interacting, can produce the previous results. It isn't acceptable to just put the risk on the average, uneducated person, who is easily swayed by the way media portrays something. We have experts for a reason, which is to gui…

Good example

Re: Top medical experts say we should decriminalize all drugs (2016)

#38

Post by beefield »

gremlinsinc wrote: post #12
Johnny555 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are lots of reasons to keep many drugs available as prescription-only. Misuse of antibiotics affects everyone, not just the person taking them. Plus, drug interactions are hard even for professionals to manage. I don't think it's a good idea to let people self-prescribe prescription drugs for themselves and others (like their children).

I agree, but if someone somehow gets a hold of drugs--and puts it in their body they shouldn't go to jail for that... putting substances in one's own body doesn't necessarily hurt others--unless they become violent as a result - but until they commit some violent crime hopped up on meth -- innocent till guilty of a violent crime. Morality and what not should not be forced on people. And most people with drug dependen…

"drinking & driving doesn't necessarily hurt others--unless there is an accident as a result - but until there is an accident -- innocent till guilty of an accident while influenced."

Do you agree also with the statement above?

My view is that most of the externalities of drug uses should be managed by taxation, not forbidden. But there are some externalities that require more brutal coercion than just taxation.

Re: Top medical experts say we should decriminalize all drugs (2016)

#40

Post by Retra »

gremlinsinc wrote: post #12
Johnny555 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are lots of reasons to keep many drugs available as prescription-only. Misuse of antibiotics affects everyone, not just the person taking them. Plus, drug interactions are hard even for professionals to manage. I don't think it's a good idea to let people self-prescribe prescription drugs for themselves and others (like their children).

I agree, but if someone somehow gets a hold of drugs--and puts it in their body they shouldn't go to jail for that... putting substances in one's own body doesn't necessarily hurt others--unless they become violent as a result - but until they commit some violent crime hopped up on meth -- innocent till guilty of a violent crime. Morality and what not should not be forced on people. And most people with drug dependen…

Violence isn't the only crime one can commit on drugs. Neglect and carelessness can also be criminal acts in some circumstances.
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