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Show HN: 1 KB JavaScript framework for building front-end applications

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Re: Show HN: 1 KB JavaScript framework for building front-end applications

#21

Post by maxpert »

jbucaran wrote: post #17
maxpert wrote: post #14

I am happy after the React fiasco these libraries are finally getting lime light. I have personally used DIO.js ( https://dio.js.org ), Vue.js and Inferno, but not Hyperapp. So far I have seen DIO outperform almost every library in heavy view cases (table with ~ 1k rows and rows itself having deep nesting). I am curious however how does hyperapp perform.

Thanks for the comment :) Hyperapp doesn't outperform DIO.js, but that was never the mission I embarked on with this project. You can see it benchmarked " rel="nofollow">https://rawgit.com/krausest/js-framework-benchmark/master/> among many other frameworks and you can see it's on the same ballpark as React. The goal of this project is to minimize the concepts you need to learn to write a modern frontend app while st…

Thanks for your response, I totally buy the argument of stateful components (believe me I have seen worst of the worst bugs due to these issues), and bringing down time to learn concept. But 300LOC, Woah! you got my attention! I think the thing that derived React was ecosystem around it (which I think FB is going to loose pretty soon), and most libraries including DIO.js (excluding Vue.js) don't have much of it.

For the comparison example you did, don't post it anywhere officially :P because I can use babel with jsx preset (I am sure hyperapp is using too) and then do the stylish lambdas to make code look cleaner. That would be a fair comparison.

Re: Show HN: 1 KB JavaScript framework for building front-end applications

#22

Post by jbucaran »

maxpert wrote: post #21
jbucaran wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the comment :) Hyperapp doesn't outperform DIO.js, but that was never the mission I embarked on with this project. You can see it benchmarked " rel="nofollow">https://rawgit.com/krausest/js-framework-benchmark/master/> among many other frameworks and you can see it's on the same ballpark as React. The goal of this project is to minimize the concepts you need to learn to write a modern frontend app while st…

Thanks for your response, I totally buy the argument of stateful components (believe me I have seen worst of the worst bugs due to these issues), and bringing down time to learn concept. But 300LOC, Woah! you got my attention! I think the thing that derived React was ecosystem around it (which I think FB is going to loose pretty soon), and most libraries including DIO.js (excluding Vue.js) don't have much of it. For…

Sorry, I am sure you could use JSX with DIO.js too. To be honest, I wasn't even looking at the JSX. I grabbed it from where I found it. The takeaway is not JSX, but the fact that they use classes and that's all.

Personally, if I was going to go with this kind of architecture, I'd choose Preact (or React if I can't help it) to tap into the massive React ecosystem.

Re: Show HN: 1 KB JavaScript framework for building front-end applications

#24

Post by jbucaran »

enobrev wrote: post #15
ryandvm wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's JSX which is basically PHP reborn as a front end technology. Everything old is new again...

JSX is more like Cold Fusion, I think.

I remember I was perhaps 17 and while I really didn't understand very well what ColdFusion was about, I wanted to try it out so badly. Unfortunately, it wasn't free, so I was never able to get do anything with it. I enjoyed AS3 to the fullest though.

Re: Show HN: 1 KB JavaScript framework for building front-end applications

#25

Post by jbucaran »

styfle wrote: post #23

Another small template engine similar to React is ".dom", weighing in at only 500 bytes! https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13605673 It only works in modern browsers supporting Proxy.

Looks really cool, other than Object.assign, Proxy and Symbol I think this is quite an achievement for that size, but I am pretty sure it doesn't support keyed DOM updates. Hyperapp was also under 1 KB before we introduced the keyed VDOM.

Re: Show HN: 1 KB JavaScript framework for building front-end applications

#27

Post by hyperpape »

diggernet wrote: post #20
hyperpape wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. The fight for really small frameworks is most relevant for consumer apps, especially ones consumed on mobile. But even on mobile, it's primarily relevant because customers get minimal value from your app or are bad at accurately assessing the value they get. In my day job, I work on a system where business users spend several hours a day using it. Loading a MB of minified JS has such a limited effect on the…

I used to need to use a large web app like that at work. You'd get a login page. Submitting your login caused the app to load, which was many MB. Once that was all downloaded, the page would finally display, and you could do what you needed to. (In our case, you usually only needed to look something up quickly and be done, which is a bit different than your case.) But the real kicker is... the company VPN was slow. R…

That's painful. I definitely think that there are cases where enterprise users would be best served by simple server rendered HTML or minimal JS.

Still, I can't help but think that the real low-hanging fruit is the slow VPN. How much time was wasted waiting for the network? So many companies are penny-wise pound-foolish.

Re: Show HN: 1 KB JavaScript framework for building front-end applications

#28

Post by mishkovski »

It is not a library. It is a framework. The distinction is important and whatever you choose influences how you test, develop and maintain your software. Libraries are slaves of your code. When you use libraries you have control. When you use a framework it is the opposite, you depend on the magic provided by it and ultimately you lose part of that control. The choice is clear for me.

Re: Show HN: 1 KB JavaScript framework for building front-end applications

#29

Post by [deleted] »

jbucaran wrote: post #17
maxpert wrote: post #14

I am happy after the React fiasco these libraries are finally getting lime light. I have personally used DIO.js ( https://dio.js.org ), Vue.js and Inferno, but not Hyperapp. So far I have seen DIO outperform almost every library in heavy view cases (table with ~ 1k rows and rows itself having deep nesting). I am curious however how does hyperapp perform.

Thanks for the comment :) Hyperapp doesn't outperform DIO.js, but that was never the mission I embarked on with this project. You can see it benchmarked " rel="nofollow">https://rawgit.com/krausest/js-framework-benchmark/master/> among many other frameworks and you can see it's on the same ballpark as React. The goal of this project is to minimize the concepts you need to learn to write a modern frontend app while st…

[deleted]

Re: Show HN: 1 KB JavaScript framework for building front-end applications

#30

Post by jbucaran »

mishkovski wrote: post #28

It is not a library. It is a framework. The distinction is important and whatever you choose influences how you test, develop and maintain your software. Libraries are slaves of your code. When you use libraries you have control. When you use a framework it is the opposite, you depend on the magic provided by it and ultimately you lose part of that control. The choice is clear for me.

I like and agree a lot with this definition too. Thanks!
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