Who are the members of the Advertising Bureau, American Advertising Federation, the Association of National Advertisers?
Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari
131–140 of 169 posts
Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari
#132Earlier quoted context omitted.
... what the hell did I just read. Let me correct the record so those that end up here don't actually buy into this. > Not all cookies are used for tracking. No, but third-party cookies are basically used for tracking. A legitimate site does not depend on a third-party cookie to handle features or login. At all, full stop no ifs, ands, or buts. > Be prepared to start losing your settings in web apps or being logged o…
> A legitimate site does not depend on a third-party cookie to handle features or login. At all Sites which use Disqus, or similar, for comments. I hate Disqus with a passion and wish horrible flaming death upon it, and am actually quite pleased that this will break it. But nonetheless it's a "legit" use of third-party cookies to provide a feature (remembering login on an embedded commenting engine).
The Mozilla comments system recently discussed on HN is a clear alternative.
Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari
#133> When Apple first announced the limitations to cross-website tracking in June, the company said the changes are meant to improve trust with users, explaining that “users feel that trust is broken when they are being tracked and privacy-sensitive data about their web activity is acquired for purposes that they never agreed to.” This! I switched from Windows+Android to the Apple ecosystem in 2015. Because I love so ma…
So how would websites earn money? Is everyone going to pay 3$ / month every website? Apple should have fixed that first, but is now blocking everyone because their own iAd failed. I think a lot is going to blow up, eg. Apple users requiring membership for websites + a subscription. What if those companies suddenly require an email to read more content, then their backend syncs all the required data. ( yes, we will su…
Ad Tech is the problem. There's a tremendous amount of media scholarship which says that advertising itself is also the problem.
See:
Jonathan Albright: "Who Hacked the Election? Ad Tech did. Through “Fake News,” Identity Resolution and Hyper-Personalization" https://medium.com/@d1gi/who-hacked-the-election-43d4019f705...
Robert McChesney, Communication Revolution (an excellent history of media failures): http://www.worldcat.org/title/communication-revolution-criti...
And, one of my personal favourites, a brief, very readable, and information-packed 1909 account, Hamilton Holt's Commercialism and Journalism: https://archive.org/details/commercialismjou00holtuoft'
As to what to replace this with: treat information as the public good it is:
https://www.reddit.com/r/dredmorbius/comments/1uotb3/a_modes...
Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari
#134Earlier quoted context omitted.
Most of HN is probably too young to remember the old brokerage ad, but websites can earn money the old-fashioned way: they EARN it. And there are plenty of websites that earn my money: NYT, The Economist, some music-related websites, a podcast or two. Whatever shall I do should, say, Buzzfeed go away? Probably make more productive use of my time. I mean let's face it, if a web page has stuff from Taboola at the botto…
NYT and the Economist ( the first you mentioned) are both websites that give content here away for free ( for ads), the others are probably niche related to your interests from fans. I don't have cable also and OutBrain / Taboola really suck. Don't visit buzzfeed and don't pay currently for articles. Because i pay them with ads. I'd like to see numbers of how much people actually pay for content, before i believe tha…
Buzzfeed actually do, no matter how much it pains me to admit it, produce some exceptionally high-quality journalism. It's a small subset of their output, but it's there.
One argument is that they're using the dreck to subsidise this. I don't know if that's long-term sustainable, but it's an interesting approach.
There's a long (nearly 200 year) history of this in journalism, dating to the Penny Press of ~1830. See Tim Wu's Attention Merchants.
Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari
#135What's especially infuriating about the advertisers' spin here is that Apple appears to have gone to a lot of effort to not destroy their business model. They're not simply blocking third-party tracking cookies, they're expiring or partitioning them more rapidly based on how infrequently the user interacts with a given website. https://webkit.org/blog/7675/intelligent-tracking-prevention...
Conveniently, some parties like mostly Google but also Facebook and Twitter have both a big presence in the tracker space and also a site users often visit directly. Their information is going to get much more valuable.
Specific to Google: 30% of Reddit users (and about 40% of HN) block Google Analytics.
Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari
#136The Law of Unintended Consequences may yet have the next laugh.
Expand?
Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari
#137> In an open letter expected to be published this afternoon, the groups describe the new standards as “opaque and arbitrary,” Funny, "opaque and arbitrary" is exactly how I'd describe the web of 3rd party tracking of consumers these companies engage in. When all of these groups agree to openly disclose everything they do to track users, see the databases they maintain on us and allow easy opt outs like agreeing to fo…
If the ad networks actually honored "DNT", Apple wouldn't need to implement this mitigation. For that matter, what are they smoking to make them believe I'll purchase $PRODUCT any second now when I still haven't clicked the 123489th retargeted ad?
Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari
#138Earlier quoted context omitted.
Conveniently, some parties like mostly Google but also Facebook and Twitter have both a big presence in the tracker space and also a site users often visit directly. Their information is going to get much more valuable.
Do Google ad tracking cookies actually live on the google.com domain? Seems like an ethical violation of some kind if so.
Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari
#139Earlier quoted context omitted.
So how would websites earn money? Is everyone going to pay 3$ / month every website? Apple should have fixed that first, but is now blocking everyone because their own iAd failed. I think a lot is going to blow up, eg. Apple users requiring membership for websites + a subscription. What if those companies suddenly require an email to read more content, then their backend syncs all the required data. ( yes, we will su…
Most of HN is probably too young to remember the old brokerage ad, but websites can earn money the old-fashioned way: they EARN it. And there are plenty of websites that earn my money: NYT, The Economist, some music-related websites, a podcast or two. Whatever shall I do should, say, Buzzfeed go away? Probably make more productive use of my time. I mean let's face it, if a web page has stuff from Taboola at the botto…
NYTimes.com is a site I've subscribed to for years.
Yet they still serve me ads and 3rd-party tracking scripts when I'm logged in.
Increasingly, I'm becoming unhappy with this and I will soon write to NYTimes.com to complain about this.
If I'm paying for access to your website I don't want to see ads. Ever.
At the very least, make ads opt-outable for subscribers.
Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari
#140Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm not even saying people don't want to see ad, I'm saying that users don't want you tracking them across other sites. A user doesn't want site A knowing that they went to site B, and that is what tracking based ads appear to be to the user. In reality it's even worse because while sites A & B, which the user does trust, don't know it is in fact a separate business they've never seen or heard of that know about you…
I think it's the opposite in most cases, you are correct in HN-context. Yes, we ( HN readers), don't want them tracking us. So that is what you think it is. But we are only a "small" percentage. Non-HN readers ( mostly non-technical readers), just don't want to see ads and don't want to pay. They also don't know how the tracking works and mostly don't care ( in my experience)
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