One valid point I've seen someone say about this in a tweet (I'm paraphrasing it):
By the time you read this comment, Facebook (presumably) already made enough profit to pay this fine.
Spain Fines Facebook Over Tracking Users Without Consent
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Re: Spain Fines Facebook Over Tracking Users Without Consent
#12I don't have anything against regulations and fines to keep monopolistic companies in check, but that being said, as an European, I can't help but feel a little appalled that there's so much focus on this and so little on actually creating European Googles and Facebooks.
The EU and many of its members have plenty of programs encouraging entrepreneurship. Stuff like http://startupeuropeclub.eu/ Whether they're actually able to lead to the creation of European Googles and Facebooks is a different question.
Those programs are mostly cargo culting and fail to address the essential aspects of an entrepreneurial environment. It's a way to seem like they're doing something rather than making the hard changes that would piss off some powerful special interests and rentiers.
Re: Spain Fines Facebook Over Tracking Users Without Consent
#13Facebook tried to pull a similar gimmick in India called "Free Basics". It was dealt with criticism and the regulatory authority in India was smart enough to reject the proposal. Reliance, one of the sheepskin corporation in India wanted to embrace Free Basics with Facebook but could not. Now Reliance is trying a similar act with "Jio" cellphones.
Its a good thing that many countries are realizing that US based monopolies are not good for their economy. Take China for example, their companies are well off like AliPay, WeChat, Tencent. Its because they are protected from monopolies who have the firepower to kill them. Keeping the monopolies in check will spur the growth & innovation in developing countries.
Re: Spain Fines Facebook Over Tracking Users Without Consent
#14A 1.2M euro (non) fine? I hope it's a "first offense" discount.
Re: Spain Fines Facebook Over Tracking Users Without Consent
#15I don't have anything against regulations and fines to keep monopolistic companies in check, but that being said, as an European, I can't help but feel a little appalled that there's so much focus on this and so little on actually creating European Googles and Facebooks.
Perhaps it is an action boosting EU-based companies? Otherwise they are at a disadvantage in competition, because US-based Googles and Facebooks game the e.g. the tax system in a way that EU-based companies cannot.
Tax avoidance isn't helping large US based tech companies aquire more users or gain more control of the Internet. It only impacts investors and executives. So that's not the reason why EU based competitors have mostly failed to reach dominant positions.
Re: Spain Fines Facebook Over Tracking Users Without Consent
#16I don't have anything against regulations and fines to keep monopolistic companies in check, but that being said, as an European, I can't help but feel a little appalled that there's so much focus on this and so little on actually creating European Googles and Facebooks.
As an investor in my first startup once put it: You want to build a company in the US because you have access to a market of 300,000,000 people right from the beginning. In Europe markets are much smaller. Munchen and Berlin are completely different markets. Germany and Spain? Fuggetaboutit. Yes you can't address that big of a market immediately, but if you're into the whole rapid expansion VC thing, having a big mar…
> Munchen and Berlin are completely different markets
In what respect? Berlin and Munich are 363 miles apart, share standard German, a currency, a time zone, a prime minister, some culture, legal system...
Are you referring to class/wealth?
Re: Spain Fines Facebook Over Tracking Users Without Consent
#17Those are the kind of regulations that should help create a consensus around the utility of the european union. Giant corporation, spending tons of marketing money to make everyone think they're trying to help the world, while behaving like scammers with regards to personal data, and like white collar criminals with regard to tax should be prosecuted to death.
> The EU considers the death penalty as a cruel, inhuman and irreversible punishment which fails to act as a deterrent to criminal behaviour.
http://www.eidhr.eu/highlights/death-penalty
edit: Hmm, now I'm not sure whether you meant a companies metaphorical death? ..I'll leave it here anyhow. :)
Re: Spain Fines Facebook Over Tracking Users Without Consent
#18Those are the kind of regulations that should help create a consensus around the utility of the european union. Giant corporation, spending tons of marketing money to make everyone think they're trying to help the world, while behaving like scammers with regards to personal data, and like white collar criminals with regard to tax should be prosecuted to death.
> The EU considers the death penalty as a cruel, inhuman and irreversible punishment which fails to act as a deterrent to criminal behaviour. http://www.eidhr.eu/highlights/death-penalty edit: Hmm, now I'm not sure whether you meant a companies metaphorical death? ..I'll leave it here anyhow. :)
Revocation of corporate charter is the equivalent of the death penalty for a corporation.
Re: Spain Fines Facebook Over Tracking Users Without Consent
#19Is Google Next?
Re: Spain Fines Facebook Over Tracking Users Without Consent
#20Earlier quoted context omitted.
The EU and many of its members have plenty of programs encouraging entrepreneurship. Stuff like http://startupeuropeclub.eu/ Whether they're actually able to lead to the creation of European Googles and Facebooks is a different question.
Those programs are mostly cargo culting and fail to address the essential aspects of an entrepreneurial environment. It's a way to seem like they're doing something rather than making the hard changes that would piss off some powerful special interests and rentiers.
One thing I hear about the startup environment in Europe is that investors are more conservative and risk-averse compared to those in the US. Would you elaborate on the "essential aspects of an entrepreneurial environment", and the hard changes that would need to be made to improve the situation?
Also curious to hear more about these powerful special interests and "rentiers" - any specific examples in mind?