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What Science Says to Do If Your Loved One Has an Opioid Addiction

fivethirtyeight.com

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Re: What Science Says to Do If Your Loved One Has an Opioid Addiction

#161

Post by ThrustVectoring »

warcher wrote: post #153

Fun fact: The current standard within the US is AA/NA. AA and NA are not only wholly unscientific, being invented of whole cloth by a layperson in the early 20th century (for context, lobotomy was a totally accepted psychological treatment for decades after 1935). There was no science whatsoever involved in AA, and indeed Alcoholics Anonymous actively resists any data collection about the efficacy of its techniques w…

The only way to fairly evaluate a program is on the difference between it and a control intervention of some sort. Like, you can't just claim that the best students must have had the best teachers. A fair chunk of data supports the claim that people have gotten sober while in AA, which is significantly different than the claim that AA helps people. Unless you've got comparisons with control groups, "good work being done there" is disputable.

Re: What Science Says to Do If Your Loved One Has an Opioid Addiction

#162

Post by krastanov »

kirse wrote: post #158
warcher wrote: post #153

Fun fact: The current standard within the US is AA/NA. AA and NA are not only wholly unscientific, being invented of whole cloth by a layperson in the early 20th century (for context, lobotomy was a totally accepted psychological treatment for decades after 1935). There was no science whatsoever involved in AA, and indeed Alcoholics Anonymous actively resists any data collection about the efficacy of its techniques w…

actively resists any data collection What an overly dramatic way to restate that these orgs are anonymous. collective refusal to take the problem of addiction seriously Incorrect. The church, particularly Jesus, does take it seriously. Addictive and destructive behavior patterns are called sin, but because this "progressive" society continues to water down right vs. wrong and tread down a path of moral relativism (th…

My understanding is that Jesus suggested helping sinners stop being sinners, not shaming them for being sinners. And "progressive" society is all about that - helping those that have failed.

Evaluating the performance of our current approach is very much "taking it seriously". This is what the OP is suggesting.

Re: What Science Says to Do If Your Loved One Has an Opioid Addiction

#163

Post by newsmania »

kirse wrote: post #158
warcher wrote: post #153

Fun fact: The current standard within the US is AA/NA. AA and NA are not only wholly unscientific, being invented of whole cloth by a layperson in the early 20th century (for context, lobotomy was a totally accepted psychological treatment for decades after 1935). There was no science whatsoever involved in AA, and indeed Alcoholics Anonymous actively resists any data collection about the efficacy of its techniques w…

actively resists any data collection What an overly dramatic way to restate that these orgs are anonymous. collective refusal to take the problem of addiction seriously Incorrect. The church, particularly Jesus, does take it seriously. Addictive and destructive behavior patterns are called sin, but because this "progressive" society continues to water down right vs. wrong and tread down a path of moral relativism (th…

Thanks, glad to see someone stand up for Jesus on HN. People act like religion is stupid here, but you make a great point to the contrary. If everything truly is relative and all that matters is what you want, why is opioid addiction a problem if that's what you want?

There is good and there is evil. The attempt to deny it, as you correctly say, causes huge problems. Like how we tell school children that they are no more than evolved animals, then wonder about why they go shooting people then take their own life.

Re: What Science Says to Do If Your Loved One Has an Opioid Addiction

#164

Post by newsmania »

krastanov wrote: post #162
kirse wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

actively resists any data collection What an overly dramatic way to restate that these orgs are anonymous. collective refusal to take the problem of addiction seriously Incorrect. The church, particularly Jesus, does take it seriously. Addictive and destructive behavior patterns are called sin, but because this "progressive" society continues to water down right vs. wrong and tread down a path of moral relativism (th…

My understanding is that Jesus suggested helping sinners stop being sinners, not shaming them for being sinners. And "progressive" society is all about that - helping those that have failed. Evaluating the performance of our current approach is very much "taking it seriously". This is what the OP is suggesting.

I don't think he's advocating shaming people with problems. I think he's just pointing out that the way our culture acts like obvious sin is hunky dory is a real problem.

Re: What Science Says to Do If Your Loved One Has an Opioid Addiction

#165

Post by anythingnonidin »

AndrewOMartin wrote: post #150
anythingnonidin wrote: post #18

OP here. An interesting takeaway I had was the importance of community. Does anyone know any non-profits or startups working to increase people's sense of community at a mass scale? It seems this is missing from large parts of the western world and has many consequences.

I've seen a couple of documentaries where KKK members were interviewed and the sense of purpose and community seemed to be the main thing they were all getting out of it. I'm not saying the KKK is a good community group, but I will say there are a lot of people with less community than they offer.

Extremely interesting. Don't suppose you have a link?

Re: What Science Says to Do If Your Loved One Has an Opioid Addiction

#166

Post by shawndrost »

kchoudhu wrote: post #2

Now that the opioid crisis is a problem for white people, science makes an appearance in the policy discussion. Contrast to the crack epidemic in the 80s: fuck'em, throw them all in prison. Edit to add: I wish the best of luck to those who have been caught up in this crisis: I'm rooting for you, and I hope every last one of you find the treatment you need. For those of us who aren't affected, it's time for some deep…

Wow. At the time I'm writing, there are 11 other responses, and they're all unconvinced/opposed/offended regarding the parent comment. I'm embarrassed by the deliberate ignorance on display.

Race was and is a key factor in American politics, and in politics everywhere. (I don't know anything about politics in, say, Cambodia, but I can tell you race is a key factor.) The civil rights movement, 20 years before crack was a political issue, faced such powerful opposition that it reversed the polarity of US political parties (causing the former Confederate states to flip to R from D).

In this light, sibling responses to the tune of "why do you have to make it about race" or "seems like it was more about X" read as worse than ignorant. You'd have to be willful to be this ignorant about politics.

My 2c: Parent comment is so obvious it is inane. But apparently I'm in the wrong here.

Re: What Science Says to Do If Your Loved One Has an Opioid Addiction

#167

Post by anythingnonidin »

AndrewOMartin wrote: post #150
anythingnonidin wrote: post #18

OP here. An interesting takeaway I had was the importance of community. Does anyone know any non-profits or startups working to increase people's sense of community at a mass scale? It seems this is missing from large parts of the western world and has many consequences.

I've seen a couple of documentaries where KKK members were interviewed and the sense of purpose and community seemed to be the main thing they were all getting out of it. I'm not saying the KKK is a good community group, but I will say there are a lot of people with less community than they offer.

Was it http://www.npr.org/2017/08/13/543259499/a-reformed-white-nat... or something else?

Re: What Science Says to Do If Your Loved One Has an Opioid Addiction

#168

Post by anythingnonidin »

wu_tang_chris wrote: post #140
anythingnonidin wrote: post #18

OP here. An interesting takeaway I had was the importance of community. Does anyone know any non-profits or startups working to increase people's sense of community at a mass scale? It seems this is missing from large parts of the western world and has many consequences.

Your comment reminds me of this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ao8L-0nSYzg

Thanks

Re: What Science Says to Do If Your Loved One Has an Opioid Addiction

#169

Post by erikpukinskis »

rajacombinator wrote: post #157
warcher wrote: post #153

Fun fact: The current standard within the US is AA/NA. AA and NA are not only wholly unscientific, being invented of whole cloth by a layperson in the early 20th century (for context, lobotomy was a totally accepted psychological treatment for decades after 1935). There was no science whatsoever involved in AA, and indeed Alcoholics Anonymous actively resists any data collection about the efficacy of its techniques w…

Got any better suggestions? Genuinely interested, not sarcasm. (Mostly.)

The OP suggested CRAFT and methadone are proven approaches. You could read the whole article it's informative and not that long.

Re: What Science Says to Do If Your Loved One Has an Opioid Addiction

#170

Post by [deleted] »

krastanov wrote: post #162
kirse wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

actively resists any data collection What an overly dramatic way to restate that these orgs are anonymous. collective refusal to take the problem of addiction seriously Incorrect. The church, particularly Jesus, does take it seriously. Addictive and destructive behavior patterns are called sin, but because this "progressive" society continues to water down right vs. wrong and tread down a path of moral relativism (th…

My understanding is that Jesus suggested helping sinners stop being sinners, not shaming them for being sinners. And "progressive" society is all about that - helping those that have failed. Evaluating the performance of our current approach is very much "taking it seriously". This is what the OP is suggesting.

[deleted]
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