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Forget Equifax. Facebook and Google Have the Data That Should Worry You

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Re: Forget Equifax. Facebook and Google Have the Data That Should Worry You

#91

Post by romwell »

blfr wrote: post #82
ams6110 wrote: post #25

I think what we're seeing are the same sorts of things that led to building codes, fire codes, licensing of architects and civil engineers. After so many building collapses, bridge collapses, or disastrous fires, people finally demanded that "build whatever you want, however you want" is not OK if you are making something for use by the general public. I think ultimately we're going to see legislation requiring licen…

It might happen but I don't think it'll work. Codes work because they deal with known, predictable, and repeated problems. You can keep improving the fire code with each disastrous fire and fire will not actively try to outsmart you next time. Security OTOH is anti-inductive because you're dealing with intelligent attackers adjusting their methods. In this environment, security code and certifications will just becom…

I disagree.

The attackers can't get the data if you don't store that data to begin with. Voila!

I think there should be legislation that simply restricts who can store which data, as well as legislation that forces open-sourcing of critical infrastructure software.

Re: Forget Equifax. Facebook and Google Have the Data That Should Worry You

#93

Post by amelius »

blfr wrote: post #82
ams6110 wrote: post #25

I think what we're seeing are the same sorts of things that led to building codes, fire codes, licensing of architects and civil engineers. After so many building collapses, bridge collapses, or disastrous fires, people finally demanded that "build whatever you want, however you want" is not OK if you are making something for use by the general public. I think ultimately we're going to see legislation requiring licen…

It might happen but I don't think it'll work. Codes work because they deal with known, predictable, and repeated problems. You can keep improving the fire code with each disastrous fire and fire will not actively try to outsmart you next time. Security OTOH is anti-inductive because you're dealing with intelligent attackers adjusting their methods. In this environment, security code and certifications will just becom…

> But maybe it will at least force manufacturers to make their products' software updateable.

Hopefully, those updates will NOT be performed remotely by the manufacturers though. Imagine a self-driving car company rushing a quick-and-dirty fix to each of its cars remotely. I'm hoping that at least some certification institute will be sitting in between both parties to make sure everything is tested correctly before it's pushed to the consumer.

Re: Forget Equifax. Facebook and Google Have the Data That Should Worry You

#94

Post by landryraccoon »

tryingagainbro wrote: post #23
arkem wrote: post #8

I'm not particularly worried, Google and Facebook have two of the best security teams in the world and spend an amazing amount of money to protect customer data. The amount of convenience I get from Facebook and Google outweigh the risk I'm exposed to in my opinion. If Governments want to create data protection regulations I'll save my opinion until I see whatever regulation is proposed but I think it'll be difficult…

I'm not particularly worried, Google and Facebook have two of the best security teams in the world and spend an amazing amount of money to protect customer data. NSA begs to differ, on both counts https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/the-nsa-files CIA too https://wikileaks.org/ciav7p1/

You're pointing out an orthogonal issue.

If the US government wants your data and it's being held in a US company, then IT security isn't the issue, it's the legal framework. No IT security will help when armed agents of the government legally enter your business and coerce you into handing over your data.

The US Government can equally detain you directly and coerce you into handing over all of your data if that's what the law allows.

Re: Forget Equifax. Facebook and Google Have the Data That Should Worry You

#95

Post by CaptSpify »

alexasmyths wrote: post #84
CaptSpify wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I do not believe that Google is voluntarily handing over any sensitive customer data to the NSA without legal compulsion Why does it matter if it's under legal compulsion or not. At the end of the day they are handing over your data. They could choose not to store it, thus making it impossible to do, but they don't.

"Why does it matter if it's under legal compulsion or not. " Because we are all obliged to follow the law.

A) No we aren't. Unjust laws should be fought. I realize that this is easier said than done, but it's still true.

B) They could organize it so that even when the law comes asking, they can't comply, but they don't.

What matters is that they are acting insecurely, and providing data that they shouldn't be storing/providing in the first place. The law is irrelevant here.

Re: Forget Equifax. Facebook and Google Have the Data That Should Worry You

#96

Post by CaptSpify »

fav_collector wrote: post #87
CaptSpify wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I do not believe that Google is voluntarily handing over any sensitive customer data to the NSA without legal compulsion Why does it matter if it's under legal compulsion or not. At the end of the day they are handing over your data. They could choose not to store it, thus making it impossible to do, but they don't.

Protection through obscurity. If the NSA needs to go through the legal process to access data, the chances of them looking through your data is much lower than if they had unrestricted access. The cost of data inquiry discourages data inquiries.

That doesn't really answer my question though. The problem is that Google is handing over data, not what method is being used to try and access that data.

Re: Forget Equifax. Facebook and Google Have the Data That Should Worry You

#97

Post by magnetic »

pjc50 wrote: post #79
orthecreedence wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can someone open a bank account in my name or take out a loan based on data google/facebook have on my browsing history? I kind of doubt it. I saw this post and immediately thought "propaganda" as well.

Not yet , but it's the sort of thing I can imagine happening in a couple of years. I think there have already been a couple of attempts at involving FB profiles in credit ratings. And of course you can be refused a job based on your social media profile, or whatever comes up when people Google for your name.

> And of course you can be refused a job based on your social media profile, or whatever comes up when people Google for your name.

I used to spend some time in some car enthusiast forum back in the early 2Ks and after a few years I lost interest, so I stopped visiting. 10 years later, I decided to visit again and noticed that many posts had been made in my name (thankfully, just with my nickname), with horrible things being written "by me". Of course I had no way of knowing that their servers had been hacked years ago, and no recourse.

I can only imagine if there was my real name used on a random server somewhere with some dirt written, uncovered by someone googling my name...

"If it's on the internet, it must be true" is a scary thought.

Re: Forget Equifax. Facebook and Google Have the Data That Should Worry You

#98

Post by 659087 »

orthecreedence wrote: post #73
_tulpa wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe, just maybe, there's a bit more at stake than just your credit rating.

Maybe I can be concerned about both at the same time. Just because Facebook and Google have damaging information about me doesn't mean Equifax doesn't. Also, I am not a homeowner, so a hit to my credit could be devastating financially. As others have said, google/facebook are opt-in. I have knowingly given them the information they have on me. Equifax is not opt-in. I have never used any of their services.

> As others have said, google/facebook are opt-in. I have knowingly given them the information they have on me.

Did you knowingly give them your credit card transaction data, too?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-switch/wp/2017/05/23...

Did you "opt-in" to being tracked across most of the web by Google Analytics?

Re: Forget Equifax. Facebook and Google Have the Data That Should Worry You

#99

Post by bogomipz »

alexasmyths wrote: post #83
bogomipz wrote: post #55

As a natural-born American you still have the choice to not sign up for a Google account or a Facebook account. You do not however have the option of refusing to apply for a social security number when your child is born. This piece looks likes little more than propaganda from the credit reporting agencies. Shame on you Bloomberg.

"This piece looks likes little more than propaganda from the credit reporting agencies. Shame on you Bloomberg." No, it's not propaganda, it's regular journalism. Google and FB are both 'large corps' whom journo bosses would be weary of offending, so no. Whenever a journalist 'names names' of big companies, they're probably doing regular journalism. The bad stuff happens when stories are suppressed to avoid upsetting…

Really, an article in the wake of the most significant data breach in the US telling me to forget about that breach and think about something else?

The first two words of this title are "Forget Equifax ..." An imperative. This is exactly propaganda.

>"Whenever a journalist 'names names' of big companies, they're probably doing regular journalism."

What? Since when is using proper nouns a defining characteristic of "regular journalism"? That is a ridiculous statement.

>"The bad stuff happens when stories are suppressed to avoid upsetting advertisers."

Do you see many ads for Google on Bloomberg? No. There is zero risk there at all. Bloomberg is not in the ad business.

The real bad stuff happens when propaganda masquerades as journalism.

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