Equifax Faces Multibillion-Dollar Lawsuit Over Hack • Hacker News Board

Re: Equifax Faces Multibillion-Dollar Lawsuit Over Hack

#251

Post by rangersanger » Fri, Sep 08, 2017, 7:23 PM UTC

My hope is that this opens a larger discussion on the business practices of these credit bureaus, the kind of data they collect, and ultimately their harm to the public good.

As far as I'm concerned, they stole my data first, then they packaged it up neatly and gave it to shady persons.

Yes, I'm aware that I "consented" to their collection of my data when I signed up for a credit card, or a car loan, but it's not a system you can realistically opt out of. If I want to rent an apartment or, sometimes, even get a job, I need to consent to a credit pull, so I need to have a positive credit history.

So, we have a private sector monopoly that I am coerced to give my data to, for free, to function in society. Seems like a good business to be in, but as an outsider I'd like to see something drastic happen. Perhaps nationalization, or breaking up of the big three with deep regulation.

*edited to add omitted "three" in last sentence.

Re: Equifax Faces Multibillion-Dollar Lawsuit Over Hack

#252

Post by __MatrixMan__ » Fri, Sep 08, 2017, 7:23 PM UTC

clamprecht wrote: post #246

hedora wrote: post #17

I'd love to see the $70B number pan out (though $500 per person is less than the damages, I think) -- Equifax is a $17B company, and would presumably stop existing if that happened. On the other hand, these things always settle out of court, and Equifax certainly won't settle the suit for more than they're worth. I said it elsewhere, but I think the right response is to opt out of the class, and sue for $1000 in smal…

They still have the death penalty for humans in the US, why not companies?

They do, it's called corporate dissolution. Not sure what precedent there is for a class action suit that results in dissolution, but it would be a pretty good precedent to set IMO.

Re: Equifax Faces Multibillion-Dollar Lawsuit Over Hack

#253

Post by matt_kantor » Fri, Sep 08, 2017, 7:24 PM UTC

larrykwg wrote: post #245

So let me get this right, this company collects credit information and someone hacked into their web server and stole highly sensitive information about most of the adult american population. Then the executives sold their stock a day before they announced the hack to the public. Besides the troubling fact that you still use social security and credit card numbers as any form of reliable authentication, how aren't th…

> how aren't there already federal agents searching every square inch of the company and interviewing key employees under oath? But no, nobody is securing this evidence

Do we know that there aren't? Would it be public knowledge if there was an investigation?

Re: Equifax Faces Multibillion-Dollar Lawsuit Over Hack

#254

Post by Misker » Fri, Sep 08, 2017, 7:24 PM UTC

paulddraper wrote: post #249

larrykwg wrote: post #245

So let me get this right, this company collects credit information and someone hacked into their web server and stole highly sensitive information about most of the adult american population. Then the executives sold their stock a day before they announced the hack to the public. Besides the troubling fact that you still use social security and credit card numbers as any form of reliable authentication, how aren't th…

> how aren't there already federal agents searching every square inch of the company Usually reserved for criminal cases, not civil ones. > regulation in the way the data can be stored and processed Have it. > regular checks need to be conducted to ensure their adherence Have it. > I can already hear Americans preach to me how the free market is great and solves all your problems. Please quote me the "solve all your…

> Usually reserved for criminal cases

Is this not? If that's the case I need to get out of this dumpster fire of a country.

Re: Equifax Faces Multibillion-Dollar Lawsuit Over Hack

#255

Post by airza » Fri, Sep 08, 2017, 7:25 PM UTC

pfarnsworth wrote: post #131

ovao wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why $1,000? And how would you prove damages equaling that amount?

$15/month for identify protection/tracking X 12 X 40 years. You can't even dispute $15/month, since that's how much Equifax charges for their identity protection, so that must be how much it's worth since they caused these damages. That makes it more like $7200 in damages, not including the cost of money over time, inflation, etc.

future payments are usually discounted rather than inflated (IE money you have to pay now is more of a burden than money you have to pay in the future)

Re: Equifax Faces Multibillion-Dollar Lawsuit Over Hack

#256

Post by paulddraper » Fri, Sep 08, 2017, 7:25 PM UTC

Misker wrote: post #254

paulddraper wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> how aren't there already federal agents searching every square inch of the company Usually reserved for criminal cases, not civil ones. > regulation in the way the data can be stored and processed Have it. > regular checks need to be conducted to ensure their adherence Have it. > I can already hear Americans preach to me how the free market is great and solves all your problems. Please quote me the "solve all your…

> Usually reserved for criminal cases Is this not? If that's the case I need to get out of this dumpster fire of a country.

IDK whether it has the potential to be, but that's how it currently stands.

I can tell because criminal cases are prosecuted by the state; civil cases are prosecuted by private parties. (And class action is always civil.)

But by all means, move to somewhere less dumpster-firey where large businesses and governments don't get hacked.

Re: Equifax Faces Multibillion-Dollar Lawsuit Over Hack

#257

Post by ThrustVectoring » Fri, Sep 08, 2017, 7:26 PM UTC

Coordinating the response here is the key part here, but "massive number of suits in small-claims court" is probably better for threatening Equifax with an existential legal threat.

Equifax employs about 10,000 people worldwide. A million small-claims cases has each Equifax employee handling 100 small-claims cases. I don't think they can handle that level of distributed legal aggression. It just takes too much time by too many people, especially if people refuse to settle for anything less than $1000.

Probably the best way to crowdsource it is to go through the process yourself, write a step-by-step guide to what you did, and post the results on social media.

Re: Equifax Faces Multibillion-Dollar Lawsuit Over Hack

#258

Post by raisedbyninjas » Fri, Sep 08, 2017, 7:26 PM UTC

logfromblammo wrote: post #205

raisedbyninjas wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Even the ones who do have their identities stolen will likely be made whole by the credit card companies." Fraudulent charges on a credit card are the least of my concerns. This opens us up to a lifetime of identity theft and insecure accounts of every sort. I'm not even sure how they can approach remedying the problem. Coordinate with the SSA to get 150 million people new SSNs at the least.

Why would people need new SSNs? It was the credit industry that misused them as combination of unique identifier and authenticator, and that is not the SSA's responsibility to fix. The government even tried to curb misuse of the SSN, but it was not binding on private entities, and they just ignored it. The solution, whatever it is, does not include anyone continuing to pretend that the SSN is now or has ever been sui…

You're absolutely correct. We should move to a well designed identity system. However I'd SWAG the development and deployment of such a system around 10-15 years if all of the involved parties were on-board. Equifax could provide the SSA a pile of money and the victims could have a reasonably effective defense against identity theft within months.

Re: Equifax Faces Multibillion-Dollar Lawsuit Over Hack

#259

Post by api_or_ipa » Fri, Sep 08, 2017, 7:28 PM UTC

larrykwg wrote: post #245

So let me get this right, this company collects credit information and someone hacked into their web server and stole highly sensitive information about most of the adult american population. Then the executives sold their stock a day before they announced the hack to the public. Besides the troubling fact that you still use social security and credit card numbers as any form of reliable authentication, how aren't th…

I think your comment can be easily interpreted as a knee-jerk criticism of American regulatory environment en mass. At best this is a straw-man, and at worse it's a hyperbolic jump to assumptions about the attack vector, existing regulations, and how you believe them to be insufficient.

It's too early to know anything for sure about the breach and certainly holding pre-made assumptions prevents a more level headed, careful analysis of the facts.

That being said, I agree that on the face of it, this is pretty damning evidence that regulations were either not in place, or were not verified to an acceptable level.

Re: Equifax Faces Multibillion-Dollar Lawsuit Over Hack

#260

Post by devy » Fri, Sep 08, 2017, 7:29 PM UTC

larrykwg wrote: post #245

So let me get this right, this company collects credit information and someone hacked into their web server and stole highly sensitive information about most of the adult american population. Then the executives sold their stock a day before they announced the hack to the public. Besides the troubling fact that you still use social security and credit card numbers as any form of reliable authentication, how aren't th…

No amount of governmental regulations can solve the current date breach trends. Even government's own intel agencies got hacked too. No organization is immune to data breaches. It's a matter of time and effort.

A lot of us here are engineers and coders. It's our responsibility to design better architecture, security conscious protocols and write securer softwares. And it's up to all of us (regardless which country you are in) to voice up and resist the idea of weakening encryption or allowing backdoors and instead advocate for adopting better and more securer encryptions to safeguard private and sensitive personal information.