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Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#81

Post by [deleted] »

spaceseaman wrote: post #38
balance_factor wrote: post #31

As it is rarely mentioned in the US media, I'd just note that the US pretty openly interferes in Russian elections, and has been doing so for a long time. It's curious this is virtually never mentioned amidst all the accusations of Russia involving itself in US elections. There are many tentacles to the US octopus, for starters you can look at an organization created by and funded by the US congress, the soi disant N…

> virtually never mentioned I (anecdotally) hear this tidbit in every comments section relating to Russia's involvement in the U.S. election. Almost as if it's a common talking point. Reminds me a lot of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism EDIT: ... And so a conversation was effectively derailed and nothing was gained. Arguing about the validity of Whataboutism or who is doing it isn't the point. It's a deflec…

[deleted]

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#82

Post by [deleted] »

takeda wrote: post #41
GabrielF00 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They've also helped millions of people get affordable AIDS medication. http://www.politifact.com/global-news/statements/2016/jun/15...

Don't want to get into Trump vs Hilary debate, but don't you think it is a bit strange that nearly every rich individual has their own foundation? A foundation that most people don't know what is responsible for. Most of the time you don't hear it doing much either. Why for example some political entities donate large amount of money to these foundations instead of the ones that are proven to do something (like red c…

[deleted]

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#83

Post by knz »

dclowd9901 wrote: post #75
CaptSpify wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting as this is the first I've heard about it (anecdotal as well). Though I admit most of my news on this comes from non-comment based news sources (tv, etc)

The US has a long and sordid history in interfering in the political affairs of other countries. That said, our government doesn't subjugate dissenters or lock up journalists. They let our corporations do that.

The US alone? Or every major political power in human history?

And if you don't believe Russia is actively running interference in other countries via "little green men" etc then I'd encourage you to read more about the current political affairs of nation states like Ukraine or Georgia. Or about a little historical event called the iron curtain and it's associated revolutions.

Many horrible things have been done in the name of Western hegemony but let's not pretend these actions occur without provocation from other geopolitical actors or without context. Can and should we do better - absolutely. But the real world isn't always as nice as our morality would like it to be.

As for your second point, are political opponents of Western leaders being beaten to death in prison? Or banned from voicing their views? Or disappeared in the night? We've got a long way to go before we're comparable to Russia in terms of how dissent is stifled.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#84

Post by Retric »

bitJericho wrote: post #74
raquo wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the line that Putin and Lavrov (foreign minister) have been pushing since forever: "you westerners are no better than us, stop shaming us for the shady things that we do". That's an easy way to keep your population happy – tell them that life is no better in other countries. Corruption is everywhere, police state is everywhere, etc. And most Russians believe that.

Well it's true in the us, Russia, china, Australia. That's not everywhere but that is quite a lot of ground.

Russia does not have actual meaningful elections. That's a fairly fundamental difference.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#85

Post by jmull »

korzun wrote: post #70
spaceseaman wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> virtually never mentioned I (anecdotally) hear this tidbit in every comments section relating to Russia's involvement in the U.S. election. Almost as if it's a common talking point. Reminds me a lot of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism EDIT: ... And so a conversation was effectively derailed and nothing was gained. Arguing about the validity of Whataboutism or who is doing it isn't the point. It's a deflec…

In most cultures, you don't criticize somebody for something while doing the exact opposite. Whataboutism does not apply to 90% of conversations but don't tell that to people who think they are smart by bringing it up. Whataboutism: A) 'You interfered with our elections!!' B) 'You bombed a children hospital! What about that?' NOT Whataboutism: A) 'You interfered with our elections!! YOU HACKED OUR ELECTIONS!!! PUTIN…

You make a poor point.

First, your definition of whataboutism doesn't jibe with ones in common use, such as https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism.

Second, your "NOT" example only works if A and B are equivalent, which, obviously they are not for several reasons. (the tactics and secrecy are different as are the elections.

Actually, you make a very poor point, when I consider the the insult you hurled at someone for daring to bring up whataboutism -- a term apparently invented to describe the tactic of deflecting criticism of Russian actions, which is exactly this situation.

Poor show.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#86

Post by Retra »

balance_factor wrote: post #31

As it is rarely mentioned in the US media, I'd just note that the US pretty openly interferes in Russian elections, and has been doing so for a long time. It's curious this is virtually never mentioned amidst all the accusations of Russia involving itself in US elections. There are many tentacles to the US octopus, for starters you can look at an organization created by and funded by the US congress, the soi disant N…

Hypocrisy is still not a fallacy.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#87

Post by stevenwoo »

spaceseaman wrote: post #38
balance_factor wrote: post #31

As it is rarely mentioned in the US media, I'd just note that the US pretty openly interferes in Russian elections, and has been doing so for a long time. It's curious this is virtually never mentioned amidst all the accusations of Russia involving itself in US elections. There are many tentacles to the US octopus, for starters you can look at an organization created by and funded by the US congress, the soi disant N…

> virtually never mentioned I (anecdotally) hear this tidbit in every comments section relating to Russia's involvement in the U.S. election. Almost as if it's a common talking point. Reminds me a lot of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism EDIT: ... And so a conversation was effectively derailed and nothing was gained. Arguing about the validity of Whataboutism or who is doing it isn't the point. It's a deflec…

On the one hand, a better beef for Russia would be the US military intervention on Soviet soil for the anti Bolshevik forces in 1917, on the other hand, that's a incredibly long time to hold a grudge/cold war, though Iran's theocracy looks like it's going to milk US interference in their country for a couple more generations, too.

The other side of this is Russian involvement in the US/Western Europe seems to follow many of the key points of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics where Putin has already though direct military action or political involvement, accomplished the goals of distancing the UK from Europe, made progress on retaking Ukraine, allied with Iran, gotten a windfall with Turkey being run by an authoritarian and distancing itself from the West, and diminished the US in the eyes of the world with the election of Trump.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#88

Post by jonknee »

ThomPete wrote: post #78

"Facebook officials reported that they traced the ad sales, totaling $100,000, to a Russian “troll farm” with a history of pushing pro-Kremlin propaganda, these people said." Excuse my ignorance but isn't $100K chicken feed?

That’s what Facebook self reported that it discovered, not necessarily the whole operation. It’s also direct evidence of non-hacking related attempts to influence the election.

Furthermore, considering there is a criminal investigation going on over whether or not the Trump campaigned colluded with Russia on such activities, the dollar amount is pretty meaningless.

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#89

Post by eighthnate »

balance_factor wrote: post #31

As it is rarely mentioned in the US media, I'd just note that the US pretty openly interferes in Russian elections, and has been doing so for a long time. It's curious this is virtually never mentioned amidst all the accusations of Russia involving itself in US elections. There are many tentacles to the US octopus, for starters you can look at an organization created by and funded by the US congress, the soi disant N…

Not only that, but the media, especially the washingtonpost, strong-armed google, facebook and other social media into turning over the news to them recently.

Visit news.google.com and check out how many WaPo links there are.

Now use waybackmachine or another internet archive and go back 3, 4 or 5 years and check out how many WaPo links there are. None.

https://web.archive.org/web/20140319161446/https://news.goog...

It's even worse in the US and World sections ( which unfortunately isn't archived ).

Now a WaPo or NYTimes article is almost the top story 24/7.

Also, the hypocrisy isn't just with russia. The media's insane coverage of NK, China and everything else. It's just opened my eyes to the fact that our media is just propaganda like anything else and they are spinning a narrative.

They got away with it when the world was bigger and people weren't as connected, but now I have family and friends living in Europe, Korea and Japan and I can interface with them in real-time and immediately know that the media is just full of it.

Are they just getting the population for a war that the elite are planning? I don't get this non-stop fear and panic inducing nonsense. Every other month, it's a war with NK or China or Russia or Terrorists. It never stops.

And so what if FB sold ads to a russian company? How much ads did they sell to everyone else? How much did canadian companies spend? Chinese companies? Israelis? British? Or most importantly, american companies?

Re: Facebook says it sold political ads to Russian company during 2016 election

#90

Post by meri_dian »

I implore everyone alarmed by recent Russian assaults on Western Democratic institutions to get their hands on an English translation of 'The Foundations of Geopolitics' by Aleksandr Dugin. Dugin is a Russian academic and the book is essentially a textbook on how Russia should seek to subvert and destabilize Europe, the US and other Russian rivals in order to forge a new empire for the explicit purpose of ethnic Russian domination of the world.

Dugin is not some fringe academic and the book is well known among the elite of the Russian state. According to the Wiki page:

>"The book has had a large influence within the Russian military, police, and foreign policy elites and was allegedly used as a textbook in the General Staff Academy of Russian military."

More on the book's approach towards destabilizing America:

>"Russia should use its special services within the borders of the United States to fuel instability and separatism, for instance, provoke "Afro-American racists". Russia should "introduce geopolitical disorder into internal American activity, encouraging all kinds of separatism and ethnic, social and racial conflicts, actively supporting all dissident movements – extremist, racist, and sectarian groups, thus destabilizing internal political processes in the U.S. It would also make sense simultaneously to support isolationist tendencies in American politics."

We must unite in the face of division, both for the sake of unity and because the Russians are actively trying to divide us.

I haven't been able to find a copy of the English translation online. I was only able to get my hands on one because of a connection that works in DC. If anyone knows where to get one online please post a link.

Wiki page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics?wpr...

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