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How Fact-Free Parenting Policies Rob Kids' Independence

5kids1condo.com

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Re: How Fact-Free Parenting Policies Rob Kids' Independence

#21

Post by new299 »

I'm sympathetic. But given the article is against "fact-free" parenting. I didn't find the data presented very compelling.

Basically you'd need to know how common crime against children traveling unsupervised on buses in a similar scenario.

The closest example presented is kids in New York riding the subway, so presenting stats on that would be useful.

I'd also like more details on the Japanese example, it's honestly not uncommon to hear news reports of kids being abducted in Japan. I'd personally be interested in the stats, but as a comparison point it doesn't make sense unless you can normalize for the overall lower crime rate that Japan has.

If anyone has good data against "Helicopter parenting", I'd be curious to see it.

Re: How Fact-Free Parenting Policies Rob Kids' Independence

#23

Post by dwaltrip »

new299 wrote: post #21

I'm sympathetic. But given the article is against "fact-free" parenting. I didn't find the data presented very compelling. Basically you'd need to know how common crime against children traveling unsupervised on buses in a similar scenario. The closest example presented is kids in New York riding the subway, so presenting stats on that would be useful. I'd also like more details on the Japanese example, it's honestly…

From the post:

> And the odds of your child being kidnapped by a stranger on the bus? Incredibly long. A 2003 study in Canada found just one case nationwide of a stranger abducting a child, in the entire two years prior.

I personally found the article very compelling. This kind of mindless fear, in direct contradiction of clear evidence, makes my blood boil.

Re: How Fact-Free Parenting Policies Rob Kids' Independence

#24

Post by oblio »

dwaltrip wrote: post #23
new299 wrote: post #21

I'm sympathetic. But given the article is against "fact-free" parenting. I didn't find the data presented very compelling. Basically you'd need to know how common crime against children traveling unsupervised on buses in a similar scenario. The closest example presented is kids in New York riding the subway, so presenting stats on that would be useful. I'd also like more details on the Japanese example, it's honestly…

From the post: > And the odds of your child being kidnapped by a stranger on the bus? Incredibly long. A 2003 study in Canada found just one case nationwide of a stranger abducting a child, in the entire two years prior. I personally found the article very compelling. This kind of mindless fear, in direct contradiction of clear evidence, makes my blood boil.

Every "bet" consideration needs to include possible loss, not only the odds. Losing your child is for many people not that far off from losing their own life, so people tend to react in a very cautious way.

Re: How Fact-Free Parenting Policies Rob Kids' Independence

#25

Post by new299 »

dwaltrip wrote: post #23
new299 wrote: post #21

I'm sympathetic. But given the article is against "fact-free" parenting. I didn't find the data presented very compelling. Basically you'd need to know how common crime against children traveling unsupervised on buses in a similar scenario. The closest example presented is kids in New York riding the subway, so presenting stats on that would be useful. I'd also like more details on the Japanese example, it's honestly…

From the post: > And the odds of your child being kidnapped by a stranger on the bus? Incredibly long. A 2003 study in Canada found just one case nationwide of a stranger abducting a child, in the entire two years prior. I personally found the article very compelling. This kind of mindless fear, in direct contradiction of clear evidence, makes my blood boil.

"A 2003 study in Canada found just one case nationwide of a stranger abducting a child, in the entire two years prior."

Without knowing if, and how many children rode the bus alone, this information is not meaningful.

Re: How Fact-Free Parenting Policies Rob Kids' Independence

#26

Post by valgaze »

daxfohl wrote: post #19
nicklaf wrote: post #3

Any countries out there where this kind of helicopter parenting isn't endemic in the culture?

Per walking / public transit to school, Japan is always the big example where many kids do so on their own. I feel like I've read this is mandatory there, but a quick search finds no backing evidence so maybe not. I'm curious though in Japan whether this is part of a general trend combating helicopter parenting, or if it's just a one-off social norm.

CBS Dec 2015 on Japan http://youtu.be/IkVvXVDs5aI

Not sure if they're common/representative, but two interesting things the mother demonstrated (2:14):

1. She can track the kid via GPS

2. When asked, she said she would never let her son walk alone to school in the United States

Re: How Fact-Free Parenting Policies Rob Kids' Independence

#27

Post by new299 »

smelendez wrote: post #20

I think the question the Ministry official asked him about what would happen if the kids start fighting is an important part of the equation. Society has gotten more legalistic. The bus driver or a random adult passenger doesn't have legally defined authority to discipline the author's kids, which means they don't have the authority at all. But basic human decency demands you intervene if you see little kids fighting…

What happens if two adults start fighting? What is the difference?

Re: How Fact-Free Parenting Policies Rob Kids' Independence

#28

Post by plandis »

mnm1 wrote: post #15

I walked the whole city I was born in and took whatever busses and trolleys I wanted (I knew all the routes) when I was 7-9 years old (in the 80's) in a city of 300-400k people. This is simply insane and stupid. It's the reason why I will never have kids in the US or Canada. What kind of shitty culture and society allows this kind of degradation of kids? Is it any wonder they grow up not knowing how to live? It's sha…

Yes, tell me more about how shitty my culture (and by extension) the people of that culture are. Any other insult you want to lay on a group of 300+ million people that you've so carelessly stereotyped without giving a careful thought about it?

Re: How Fact-Free Parenting Policies Rob Kids' Independence

#29

Post by new299 »

daxfohl wrote: post #19
nicklaf wrote: post #3

Any countries out there where this kind of helicopter parenting isn't endemic in the culture?

Per walking / public transit to school, Japan is always the big example where many kids do so on their own. I feel like I've read this is mandatory there, but a quick search finds no backing evidence so maybe not. I'm curious though in Japan whether this is part of a general trend combating helicopter parenting, or if it's just a one-off social norm.

It's not mandatory, but it is common. It's a social norm that has been common practice for many years. It's common both in towns and in the countryside.

I would say (but don't have data to show) that there's is a slow trend against it. Possibly because of recent high profile abductions...

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